Would someone please explain to me how it is possible having faulty equipment can cause you to lose a match.... and its not your equipment??? If anyone that was at Baldwin today and saw the quarter-finals could please answer that one, I'd love to know. Having long hair is a personal decision, and I'm not blaming the wrestler, but the kid could not keep his hair under his skull cap and the skull cap was sticking up several inches. Our kid gets on his head and the skull cap slides forward. We lose a trip to state, because a coach tells the ref. that our kid was pulling on the kids headgear, and we lose by that BOGUS call by one pt. in OT. The ref. should have let the kids wrestle it out. The wrestler had his skull cap all taped on for the next match, something the refs should have insisted upon at the beginning of the tourney. Refs determined the outcome of many of the matches today, and not saying they were all bad, but this one was clearly BS.

To clarify, I did not say to the ref that the PV wrestler pulled on the headgear for him to make this call. The ref saw it on his own and made the call. All involved could verify this. When the PV wrestler pulled on the headgear, the asst. referee saw it and immediately held his hands in a T to indicate a Technical Violation. He explained to the head referee what he saw and that it occurred before the PV takedown and would thus nullify that score.

I am very sorry the match had to end this way. But there is a rule that addresses this and the PV wrestler did pull on the headgear (the ear piece, not the skull cap)....was it intentional or not? I have no idea, probably not. But the referee saw it and made a call.

It was a very good match by both wrestlers.

Regards,
Kit Harris

I'm surprised you aren't complaining about the PV takedown taken away in OT in the lighter weights...the kid gets all mad then doesn't have his head on straight and loses on a takedown to a Paola kid.

Didn't see ,or have enough information on this to say (although, I heard the same situation happened in the heavier weights in the finals and the points were awarded differently). However, the PV kid did get excited when he thought he was on his way to state and then (in his sophomore mind), he had it taken away from him. I think (Just my opinion) that he had a right to be upset.
What about the headgear call??

Right call on the headgear, however I thought it was kinda funny that the Baldwin kid started pulling it down to almost cover his face while the refs were conversing, and then straightened it all up once they had made a decision.

Didn't see that, but shouldn't that gear been taped on in the first place?
I've seen several matches this year that was effected by headgear. Such as headgear coming off many, many times and giving the wrestler a much needed breather. Might be a topic for next years rules meeting.
As far as the head gear call today, even the wrestlers coach said he didn't know if it was intentional or not, a call made by the asst. referee, to determine the outcome of such an important match was pretty sad, especially since "whatever" happened to Baldwin wrestlers head did not impede him in any way. I think its sad for both boys that the match ended this way. Should have got to wrestle it out!

Fort Scott had a situation in the finals where a kid had a lot of time to get headgear fixed or something, but I think that was under blood time perhaps? Anybody know how that situation was handeld if it was blood time or is it ref's time?

Post deleted by oldtimer81

I personally know the prairie view kid and he is a friend of mine. and for how much i wanted him to finish out and win the close match to make a trip to salina, the call is right. He had ahold of the earpiece of the headgear and the ref made a good call. Its disapointing, but thats the way it is sometimes. And i agree with oltimer81, the kid does need to cut his hair

I saw the match and Kitt is correct the Assit REF did make the call and it was correct.The PV kid had a firm hold on the ear piece of the head gear. I also think the hair was out of the cap as well. Kitt did not influence the call.I do agree that the hair is an issue. Its unfortunate it came down to that because it was a very good match to that point.

i say make the kids choose between their hair or wrestling. if they choose their hair, they must not really be interested in wrestling anyway.

Just another outsider that witnessed it and agree totally with the call. One thing that could really help these situations is to give the assistant ref the ability to blow the whistle and jump in to stop the match immediately before anything could happen which can cause hard feelings. To say the coach (Kit) caused the call is crazy, the assistant ref made the signal immediately. It was obvious that the PV had a hold of the head gear. Not saying it was on purpose, but obvious and had to be called.

Now the long hair in my opinion is totally wrong, this liberal view of letting people express themself is a bunch of crap. Get the sport back to being clean cut. Maybe the head gear would have been much closer to the head and wouldnt have been grab, another issue that needs to be readdressed by the state.

Just my feelings

What a terrific idea!

This is being discussed on another "topic", but what is the role of the assistant ref.? I thought they were there to refer to if the head ref. was unsure. Kind of a stand by, there only to make calls if asked to.
If the pulling of the head gear was so blantently obvious then why didn't the head ref. call it. Also, it wasn't just the PV crowd making all the noise over that call, so many of us missed it!

The call was grabbing the headgear..had nothing to do with the hair although the hair and hair cover was a problem in that match (haircover kept coming off). Grabbing the headgear is illegal, it often happens in the wink of an eye, but it is illegal, just like locked hands. The assistant is supposed to signal it just like he is supposed to signal any other illegal hold he sees. He doesn't blow the whistle. He doesn't wait to be asked. The main official may not have seen it, he might have been on the other side, might have been watching something else, or might not have noticed it. The two officials working that match are very good officials and the assistant was solid all weekend. It was illegal, it was called, and it was a point. It was Regionals, unfortunately, otherwise no one would care.

Post deleted by wrestling75

I suspect Ben Askren is pretty interested in wrestling and he seems to be doing ok with long hair

Post deleted by babyg

Earlier in the tournament, another wrestler was penalized one point because his shoes where not taped up. Why wasn't this wrestler penalized a point when he showed up with his hair sticking out of the cap? I was watching the match from the very top and I did not see what happened. I had to ask several bystanders to explain what had happened. One didn't see anything either and the other one said it looked like the kid had pulled down the cap (no one said anything about the earpiece or headgear being grabbed).

I say that the wrestling community adopt the same rule they have in the NFL when it comes to hair. In the NFL, you can have long hair but your opponent can also use it to tackle you.

Let's do stick to the facts. There are two things going on here.

1. Illegal Grasping of the Headgear -- Clearly a Violation.

Let's take the easier one first. The assistant saw a grasping of the headgear which is illegal under Rule 7-3-2. It does not matter if the head official saw it, that's what the assistant saw and signaled. In fact, it is why you have the assistant and head official opposite each other--if the assistant saw it, the head probably could not. As a veteran offical, you understand the rules and the call. There was nothing wrong with that call and if the assistant saw it, he had to call it. That's a TV and a point. This gets called all the time, just like locked hands or grabbing the singlet. Boos from the fans or coaches does not change a violation and it was the right call. Its not a "questionable" call at all, its a questioned call..questioned by those who didn't like it and who probably didn't see it--not because it didn't happen, but because they weren't on the mat. Its a big match, folks are worked up and blinded by emotion, so what's new about that? An official will see that that a thousand times in thirty years. Unless you have some film, let's support that call rather than criticize it.

2. Hair Coming Out of a Hair Cover is Not Illegal.

What about the hair? First, it has nothing to do with the grasping call so someone is looking for a "make up" point to even out the match score. There could have been any number of other "missed points" in that match or any other match. Again, its the emotion of the circumstances talking, not the facts. The hair is a "red herring" issue. By rule, if the hair cover was on and IF the hair met the rule at the start of the match, there was no violation. Under Rule 4-2-2, if the hair is longer than allowed by rule "it shall be contained in a cover so that the hair rule is satisfied." This does not require that the hair be completely inside the cover, it only requires that it meet the hair rule (not below the earlobe and off the collar--doesn't matter if its in the eyes). So sticking out doesn't make it illegal. IF the hair was sticking out and longer than allowed by rule, as you say, then it would have been a violation - failing to report ready to wrestle--TV, injury time and a point. But that isn't what was called and apparently there was no complaint by the opposing coach at the beginning of the match. So I am going to assume the cover and hair were legal to begin with, or that nobody really cared. If that was not the case, then the opposing coach in this match, and in any earlier matches during the day, had every opportunity to alert the officials but apparantly there was no complaint until this match. In fact, the kid that lost this close match by a point could be asking his coach a pretty pointed question right about now.... But let's be paying attention to what really matters--good sportsmanship, support for the wrestlers, coaches, and officials, and making the trip to state a good experience for all those fortunate enough to qualify.

Once that match was started, and assuming the hair cover was legal, there should have been no charged time-out or penalty assessed if it became illegal or was first noticed during the match. Under Rule 3-1-5, "a referee's time-out shall be declared for the purpose of correcting legal equipment which becomes illegal or inoperative through use." There is no number on the limit of referee time outs. So, if there is a complaint, it should be that the kid was charged with a time out when the head cover become illegal during wrestling. It should have been corrected using an official's time out, just like when the headgear comes off repeatedly--you fix it but you don't ding the kid. It was an error to charge an injury time out for this situation. And certainly there could never, by rule, be two injury timeouts for the same illegal equipment in the same match. The first time out would fix the problem, making the equipment "legal" -- thereafter it would always be a referee's timeout under the rule. So no points for that.


So once again, we have a controversial call that really wasn't controversial at all, under the rules. It was controversial because of the outcome and a misunderstanding of the rules.