What did everyone think about the officiating at state?

I thought it was horrible, seen alot of bad calls. I also think if your gonna ref, then you need to ref and ref only, if you want to coach, then coach and coach only, I dont think you should be allowed to do both. Also if you are the ref at a certain mat and a wrestler comes up that is from the same town that the ref is then I think you should let another ref do that match. Just my opinion.

I am glad to see that I am not the only one who feels this way.

From what I saw which was mainly younger kids I think they did a good job. Here is one thing for you to think about: If over the year they did a bad job they wouldnt be there, the clubs in the district each nominate so many refs.

I think for the most part, they did a fantastic job, kudos to refs who worked the younger kids, Beltch, McCullough, the young Woody gal and Mom, just awesome in your style interacting and keeping the young ones positive. Mark Anderson was outstanding as well,,great job.

There were a couple of times when refs "swallowed their whistle," I have been there in those shoes and totally know what it feels like so i am not quick to criticize anyone who wears the stripes. But someone needs to make a strong suggestion to Mr. Gallet, to concentrate on running tournaments and not officiating them.

Henry is a great advocate of wrestling, a very nice man, totally dedicated to wrestling, but he has been consitently inconsitent the past 10 yrs of wearing the stripes.

illegalhold states:

"But someone needs to make a strong suggestion to Mr. Gallet, to concentrate on running tournaments and not officiating them.

Henry is a great advocate of wrestling, a very nice man, totally dedicated to wrestling, but he has been consitently inconsitent the past 10 yrs of wearing the stripes."

Is this not the tournament director from District I North which allowed the weigh in fiasco ( see thread titled 12 Under 80 District I 9 man bracket)

I know I do not want this individual running any tournamet where my children compete. I can not trust the weigh in procedure!

I think one word sums it all up well:

INCONSISTENCY

I saw a lot of stalling not called

To Brett Shoffner you have the biggest reason to gripe of anybody who ever wrestled in this state! The referee decided the state championship! I saw alot of bad calls this past weekend but nothing will ever replace the decision I saw in your match! I wonder if that ref was related to your competitor! I personaly will never forget his decision or face! I wonder if there is any way to see that he never referee's another match in this state?

I coached one mats 2, 5, and 9 and have no complaints. On mat 5 during a 10 and under 95# match there was a HUGH time keeping error and the ref throughout difficult circumstances kept the incident under control. I think his # was 135 but I'm not sure. If anyone knows the ref's name I'd like to commend him on a job well done.

The official of whom you speak is Billy Gaskill from Salina. He was indeed working mat 5 & 6 throughout both days, Billy is a good one and did a nice job. But again as I've said before there is no reason to make excuses for losing. Blaming the officials for your loses won't do any good so get over it, move on, get better, and next time you won't leave the match close enough to have it decided by a referee's call.

Richard,

Your comment is way off base. To equate an error in judgement on a weigh in as a basis of never allowing a kid into an individual's tournament based on that error is ridiculous.

What is even more ridiculous is some of the analogies of people with way too much time on their hands. For example, I heard one hypothesis on why this happened and it centered around allowing it to happen so District One could beat out a District Two kid. I will profess that there are times that I think there are underlying reasons of why things happen, but eventually sanity will creep into my brain and say, "that's just silly gibby."

Was it an error, yes. Was there an attempt to correct it, yes. Do we cut a guy's hand off at the neck for a screw up, no. Your comment was way off base and I would hope your were man enough to apologize for such a horrible statement like not ever sending your kids to a tournament run by him.

In a world consumed with various criminal acts upon kids, here is one guy that's trying to do the right thing. He was there at 8:00 am to help set out the mats. He was there all weekend to officiate. Wrestling is a big part of his life and to have his character questioned and scrutinized is plain wrong.

If it is yours and others mission to publicly criticize an individual for his volunteerism toward the sport to help make it better to the best of his ability, I suggest that each of you get busy and study the rule book, pass the test, organize the tournaments, put on the stripes, and volunteer your time in helping make this tournament successful. Somehow I don't think I'll see you bright and early on Friday to help with Nationals.

There's truth to the saying put up or shut up.

I'm sorry if I sound "huffy," but I don't agree with using this forum as a way to belittle a person and it bothers me because there is now way to defend yourself on this forum other than the moderator removing the post. Even that is a bad way to defend a man's integrity. There's no chance for rebuttal.

I apologize if I sound nasty, that's not my intent. It's hard to convey tone in a post. With that being said however, I don't agree one bit on the manner in which some abuse this forum. I'm not saying you do in particular, as I'm sure there are others, this just happened to catch my eye and upset me.

To Coach Gibson:

You state "Your comment is way off base. To equate an error in judgement on a weigh in as a basis of never allowing a kid into an individual's tournament based on that error is ridiculous.

This was not an error in judgment! This was rule breaking! I can not trust this individual to ever monitor a weigh in again, and I submit many parents in your district will agree!

I owe no one an apology, and to the contrary, those involved in the error owe all participants in the tournament an apology. This wrong will never be corrected and the damage is done.

The wrestler did not make weight and the Tournament Director allowed him to wrestle.

If this was the KSHSAA Regional, would you expect the overweight wrestler to be allowed to compete?

This was a blatant violation of USAWA Kansas Kids Rules.

Perhaps you should read rules before commenting!

Please, do not attempt to lecture me on volunteerism, as I have certainly done my fair share, and can be attested to by many in my District.

I will stand by my statement, and strongly suggest the offending parties do the right thing and resign their positions, as their credibility is forever tainted!

We need volunteers who conduct themselves as professionals, and not allow this sort of nonsense! This incident has forever stained our sport, and can not be dismissed or swept under the rug!

If I sound defensive, I will not apologize as I am shocked with your cavalier attitude toward this huge injustice!

The poor decision making by District I officials calls into question the integrity of the weigh in procedure. It did happen once, perhaps there are others we do know about!

Ask all who know me, (Mr. Juby, Mr. Disney, Mr. Grater)and they will attest to the fact I will show up for a personal discussion if you so desire! They will also attest to the fact I rarely speak unless I know what I am talking about.

This was not a personal attack, I was stating a fact!

Get a grip on reality!

"I love to brag about myself"---Richard Salyer

was this gallet the ref on mat 8

Mr Salyer on several occasions has had something not good to say about some of my opionions which I didn't appreciate, but he is entitled to them. However I must say and im going out on a limb here, I completly support him in this issue. There is to be no execption to a standing rule unless there are provisions in the rule which there is not in this case. If the kid did not make weight on time then he does not wrestle, period! Now we have something in the justice system called case law (I think thats the word), which basically means that when a judge makes a ruling then that case is often looked back on in the present and a similar decision is usually ruled. So now that this kid was allowed to compete, anytime a wrestler in the future doesn't make weight cause his parents couldn't get there on time or whatever the excuse was for not making it then that kid gets another 45 minutes to make weight. Write it down in the books, and make sure this gets passed into the Kids consitution at next years meeting cause I want to make sure that someone from my club gets the same opportunity should we need it. Richard I am right behind you on this issue and I will support you in anyway that I can, if you need it.

The officiating at state are the best kansas kids wrestling official.All coaches & wrestler should be thankful for the job they did ...ITS NOT a easy job .( I official for 6yrs in the 80s were about anyboby could be at mat side )
Officiating is getting worst in kids wrestling over the last three yrs (NOT TALKING ABOUT THE OFFICIAL AT STATE) Needs to get better in the regular tourments in the seasons .There are alot of bad officials....A official should have 5-6 yrs of wrestling experience to know there are many different styles of wrestling & whats
potentially dangerous.
Wrestling in the 70s-80s some coaches want to get there ref card so some tourments would have enought ref .They all are very fair with there calls BUT wouldnt ref someone from there team or town or relation ...In this days & time you only should do one or the other
OLDTIMER

Richard,

My point is this. The error in judgement or rule breaking did happen, that's simple enough to understand. The perception of that decision can be viewed as differently by various people. To those on the outside, it could be viewed as a attempt to put the best on the mat for district/state. It could also mean that for a brief moment the individual lapsed in judgement and the district tried to rectify the situation as best they could. To say that the kids that got beat out have had the trauma of their lives is somewhat of an overstatement. There are bigger things that happen in our lifetimes that a screw up like this.

And what a great teaching opportunity for the kids involved. The lesson is quite simple. You may have prepared yourself the correct way, but sometimes things don't go the right way. It's the same lesson I teach my seniors. You may have been the best prepared, but sometimes things don't go your way and someone who is undeserving gets to move on. However, life doesn't end here, but is a bump in the road hat you have to get through. The sun will rise tomorrow.

A lot can be learned from this and there should be some reactive steps to make sure this doesn't happen again. I do have some suggestions, but I'll admit, these are not my ideas, but are ideas that someone else has given me and I've been thinking about it and it seems to make sense. I don't know exactly if these would be district adoptions or state adoptions.

Adoption one - allow tournament directors the opportunity to use good judgement when there are individuals that are late. This will cover those that are caught in snow storms or bad weather or have transportation problems. Does this mean some will abuse the rule? Probably. Then again, it also covers legitimate issues of safety for the participants on the way to the tourney. The key here is to do what's in the best interest for the kids and to keep them safe.

Adoption Two - weigh-ins are conducted with the athlete stepping on once, then if they want to contest one scale, they can get on another. If the weight is the same, that's the weigh in. It would eliminate last minute weight cutting (something I personally don't like to see). This would also clear up the grey area of weighing in late because I was cutting vs. car trouble, weather, etc.

The reason I back the tournament director has nothing to do with rules, but has to do with what I would have done in that situation. More than likely, I would have done the same thing. I could see myself doing it because I'm the kind of guy that says "screw the rules" when I believe that it's in the best interest for kids. The kid was late, so we penalize the kid for an error made by his parents. Critics would say, "well you penalized the others for allowing him to wrestle." And that bothers me. Like it or not, sometimes there is an underlying current of getting a kid to state at all costs. I'm the type of guy that is willing to let a guy better than my kid into the tournament and hope that my kid has a great day and beats him. I'm a little weird like that though.

I received an e-mail from a parent or athlete this morning that was adamantly opposed to the position I have taken. I probably lost more than one "internet fan" in the process of admitting that in the individual's situation I probably would have done the same thing, not realizing the ramifications when I did it. With that being said, I hope there are others out there that would help guide me in how and where to get these adoptions passed. If it's a state body issue, I just hope next year we have enough clubs present to make a quorum.

Richard, my words yesterday were rough, and I do apologize if I came across in a rude manner. That does not mean that if I were put in the same situation, I would have done differently.

You need to change your name from Coach Gibson to "I am a Complete Idiot Gibson" Your comments should be appalling to anyone who is called Coach.

To jayhawkmom,
No, the opponet Brett Shoffner was wrestling was not related to the ref, the ref saw something you evidently missed. In most cases, it is illegal to grab your opponets (privates) and check their oil. Before the match even started, someone heard him bragging that he was the best "oil checker" around. Two officials were on the mat during the overtime and it was the second official that seen the incident. That is why the match ended the way it did. Tournament directors also seen the match and said it was called correctly.