The greatest aspect of this sport is the wrestle off. It doesn't matter if your daddy is the president of the booster club or your mom is superintendent of your school district, if you can't beat the guy at your weight you are not on the team! The wrestle off can eliminate subjectivity and politics. I have watched our Schoolboy, Cadet and Junior dual teams assembly process for five years now and we are missing the boat! The more competitive it is to make the team the better the team will be. If we want to promote participation and competition then we have to look beyond just using the State FS/GR Tournament as a qualifier. We need a prep camp and it is logical to use the Southern Plains camp for this purpose. I was and remain outspoken about mandating the attendance of this camp to participate in the tournament but I would support mandating the attendance if you are to compete on any of these teams (unless Schoolboy Duals falls before the tournament). A prep camp is the best way to assemble the potential team members to establish the starting line up and alternates. The coaches of these teams could each get their own practice gym to work these guys outs and have wrestle offs each evening that all of the kids could watch. Perhaps if you have won state you would have to be beaten best out of three if you lost the first wrestle off. This would keep support for the State FS/GR Tournament. We cannot mandate a single spring event during the school year as this would eliminate many of our best wrestlers if they have other school related functions. What are some other ideas? Lets fix this process! If you don't wrestle a single spring event, attend the SP camp or compete in the State FS/GR tournament do you deserve to be on the dual team?

I think the state tournament should be moved back so it won't conflict with graduation, prom etc.. and this should be the qualifier for all of the dual teams. This would increase participation at the state tournament and add excitement to the event. Why make parents pay for a camp to qualify for the dual teams. By June my wrestling budget is just about depleted and mandating the southern plains camp for dual team participation would make me think twice about even letting my son participate. With 4$ a gallon gas and the price of the camp we would probably just go fishing instead. I think a lot of states use state as a qualifier.Why can't we do this also. Some people may have a unlimited budget for wrestling but most people don't.

My son is going to be a senior next fall and this is his first freestyle season so I really do not have any experience with this to have an opinion on the selection process for the teams.

tbau does make an excellent point about costs going forward. With gasoline prices now at $4 a gallon and the potential it has for a ripple effect over the rest of prices, people are becoming very stretched financially. Higher food costs are also now a major factor. People are forced to make sacrifices and adjustments in many things in their daily lives. I would imagine that more of the older kids are having to work all summer long and may not be able to get away as easily for some of these events as much as they used to. Wrestling may have to make future changes to address this increased personal financial burden that families are facing. I don't know what those changes need to be but I do believe it is going to be a bigger factor going forward.

While I agree with both Will and Vince, there is another side of the issue. As in Lucas' case, while he has not wrestled freestyle or greco he was asked to join the team. Even though we were a little puzzled about this, the fact remains there are a lack of bigger boys wrestling the summer do to football, in my opinion. Lucas started on weights and conditioning June 2nd. He also has attened KU and MU football camps along with working 4-6 shifts a week at Red Robin. I know not all the kids play football, but I can see where there might be a lack of wrestlers to fill the upper weights.
In that case, do you still go with the ones that may help the team out or do you let the ones that are wrestling freestyle and greco have the spot?

To make the KS national team should be quite an honor and something a wrestler should aspire to achieve. The difficulty with our current system is that it is not well defined. It’s human nature that most, if not all, people want their incentive systems well defined. In speaking with the parent of a double Fargo champion he commented, “There has to be some defined criteria”
Coach Peterman makes some great points in his posts about having FS/GR state champions securing a spot but then goes on to say that those state champions may not be the best our state has to offer so he tries to garner and “All American” caliber team wherever he can find them. Can’t fault the coach.
As a state we are attempting to grow FS/GR and our championship numbers indicate we are making progress but, we still don’t attract “the state’s best” for some reason or another. There will always be conflicts; prom, work, family, injuries and so on. No system will catch everything.
The trouble I have with the system we have today is that allows wrestlers to make a national team who “elect” not to wrestle anyone from there own state. If you believe things you read or hear, there will be members of our respective teams that were available to wrestle at our state tournament, Southern Plains camp or the Southern Plains tourney but made a choice not to do so. To me that is just wrong. I can understand missing one or the other but all three? How can you lay claim to be the best if you don’t wrestle the rest?

I would suggest the following for Cadet and JR:
1. State Champions in each disciplines are guaranteed a FULLY FUNDED spot on the national team (this includes Fargo) if they so chose.
a. Prior to leaving the state tournament each wrestler must declare whether they intend fill their spot on the team. If they don’t declare they lose their spot.
i. This will help the coaches determine head count on day one.
b. This should also increase the incentive to participate at the state tournament.
i. This also means we need to continue to improve the FS/GR state tournament “operations”
2. All national team members must attend a “national team camp”. This may be a Saturday somewhere or it could be Southern Plains.
3. At this camp the weight classes can be challenged for spots on the national team.
a. I might suggest the current state champion must be beat 2 out of 3
4. If the national team still has openings or needs alternates the coach can fill these positions using the state tournament and the team camp as criteria in their decision.

It’s not perfect but it’s a start.

Dean Watson

This summer is the first year that we absolutely had to re-consider our normal summer wrestling routine. Some of it was based on having to make and save some $ for college, some of was based on expense of travel. We have combined volunteering and working tournaments to help with both in the past, Southern Plains both in Carlsbad and Hays were just amazing experiences for my family. We weighed it out this year and we just could not rob peter to pay paul to make this summer work.

I think the experience of wrestling on the dual teams and regionals and Fargo are priceless and should be done if at all possible. They are the ultimate in the true wrestling experience in my opinion.

We appreciated the change in the state tournament this year, it helped us and I think in the future, as long as there are additional tournaments earlier it will help in the earlier decision of the state teams.

Some great points Dean. The State tournament has to be the starting point in determining the Dual teams. I also like the idea of claiming your spot before you leave the State tournament. There should also be a "last chance" qualifying opportunity at a national team camp, to give those who could not make it to the State tournament to earn their spot on the team. The first few years will be painful and are sure to leave off "the best" wrestler at a few weights, but ultimately will strengthen our selection process and enhance our Freestyle/Greco participation.

Yes it is an extreme honor to be asked to wrestle for the National team and Lucas is very honored to get named to that team. On the other hand, Lucas is training for football, his choice for college. But when Coach Peterman called and asked to Lucas, he decided he would do it to help Team Kansas. He is actually giving up the camp at Iowa State for the Nationals. Not to mention adding wrestling practice to his already busy schedule. He will do all he can to give his all for the team, but when he made the choice to go for football in college, he had to give up summer wresting to achieve that goal.

I watched Vincent battle last year at Cadet duels, he is a great competitor. I think it's great that Vince can help this year and all wrestling fans appreciate his sacrafice. That said, if Vince wants to pursue his dreams in football then that is exactly what he should do. Summer wrestling may not fit his schedule next year and that's O.K.. In his absence maybe another wrestler will step up and fill the void.

Good luck at the Cadet duels!

Dean

Some good ideas, a wrestle off would be nice, in fact that is what happens some what at the clinic on Wednesday before the tournament. Just like in the Olympic trials which are going on this next weekend, past team members may enter. Lucas was on the team last year and proved his worth. Also I am not demeaning the quality of our other two heavyweights. They earned their spots and I plan on them being successful at the Dual Tournament. This is a team sport, its the Duals. I get 25 wrestlers for 17 weights. That means I get 8 not necessarily backups but extra wrestlers to support the team effort to perform.
The Greco state tournament had 1 - 215 pounder and 1 - 285 pounder
The Freestyle had only 2 - 215 and 3 - 285 pounders
Not much to choose from.
The only ones of those wrestlers who signed the sheet that they were interested in doing duals were Leo Beck, John Denner, and Jesse Austin, all who are on the team.

The problem is numbers, we need more kids wrestling greco and freestyle, especially at the heavier weights. If we make it even more difficult to be a team member that means there will be more holes in the lineup. Which means more kids to call and try to fill a team. At some weights it is a tough time to make the team and at others, I can't find nobody. I had only 26 wrestlers sign up that were interested in even doing duals at the State tournament. I am still looking for another 84 and maybe 105/112 and will probably have some guys wrestle both styles that I wanted to have them do just one. That has been our problem in the past we get beat up in greco and did not perform well in freestyle or we split to have two freestyle teams and had no backups and the second team would have 5 to 7 forfeits because I could not find enough kids to do it. Every year it is the same thing some good wrestlers get left off the team because they are at some tough weights while other weights there is no one there.
But keep up the good discusion, I am willing to do what the people want because you guys are Team Kansas, I just get the fun job of organizing the mess.

Coach Peterman

I recognize your stuck between a rock and a hard place. Despite the up hill battle you still put together a great team. As a state, our numbers are low but, we are seeing some growth. The problem we have is that our FS/GR numbers kind of in that "in between" stage (showing signs of life but not quite there yet). That's why I tried leave the option open to the coaches that if we don't have the numbers or all of the slots filled you can go out and get the kids.
Hopefully, over time, we can continue to fill the slots via the defined qualification process.
Facts are the distribution of kids weight put the really small and really big at the tails of the bell shaped curve. We may always struggle to find those weights.

Dean

I got to say that Coach Peterman does an outstanding job of putting together the best team he can. Having a little practie w/ this at school boys I can tell you it isn't as simple as putting the top guys from State as the starters. What if you have two really good guys at 130 at state (just an example) and both can beat the 140 pound guy. Are you really going to penalize one of the 130 guys for wrestling a tough weight?

By the time the camps are through and the duals start the coaches and the boys have a pretty good idea what the best lineup is. All the coaches do a good job of getting kids in. I haven't been around too many kids who at the end of Cadet duals complained about the amount of matches the wrestled being too few.

Hey I know that the coaches do everything they can to fill the best team they can. I also realize that it's tough for the upper weights to get filled since alot of them will do track during the spring. I believe that all of you have good ideas about the process for making the team. About Lucas he's extremely talented at what he does however how old is Finney and Heuitus are they to old to compete at the cadet duals since they are the two best Sopohmore HWTS?

Yes, both are too old to compete as Cadets....Lucas just turned 16......