try that link again, that one isn't around

Sorry I tried that link and it has been archived already. I have it saved on my desk top but don't know how to move it here.

Hey KU still made money if it was just their football program that they were playing for but it isnt. They are supporting those womens programs that you are so diligently defending. So you are going to critisize football programs for not being able to support all those other sports and still call them the culprit. Pretty funny dicotomy there don't you think.

Well, I'm not defending anything, but I will to the death cause my daughter played if you want me to. I meerly stated that not all football programs make money, and they don't

Well there you go. You have a vested interest in it. Thats what I said in the other thread if I had a girl in sports maybe I would argue it too. I am all for girls athletics I just don't want to see a two thousand year old sport scuttled in this country to help them. We scrapped to get what we had let them do fundraisers and beg for money the way we had to. Power to them.

Been there, done that
And pardon, as a former AD for four years, I've seen more than my share of fundraisers

I don't want to lose a 2000 year old sport for them? Are you kidding? You are blaming women for wrestling being eliminated. How about we just eliminate women from sports, then wrestling would stay alive. We should then take the women who want to be athletes and shoot. Hitler uh I mean Westfahl, the world does not evolve around you and wrestling, get a life. Find someone else to blame.

We should then take the women who want to be athletes and shoot them.

Very intelligent quote there. If you can't think of something to say just resort to the absurd. Nice going. Might rephrase that and say let them do it the old fashioned way and earn it or at the very least look at the rule with some common sense involved and not harm things that good people have worked so hard to build.

by the way this is a wrestling board. I am sure there is a womens volleyball board you might feel more fullfilled on. You get testy when you argue a point don't you. Lots of junk on that post of yours. Why does wrestling have to be sacrificed for the sake of womens athletics? Your the one that opened that up. Hitler huh... wow that is creative. Been called a lot of things in my time but that wasnt one of them. I won't stoop to that sort of thing here, I will however continue to think that we have been harmed by this rule and I will say so even if it means I have to be called some rediculous degrading name to do so.

By the way isnt this the point where I am supposed to stick out my tongue at you or do that little sticks and stones line or something. I feel like I should be really juvenile to reply to that Hitler deal but for the life of me I can't remember how that goes. What do you say Sands I am sure you can help me with that response.

I've been reading this thread for the last couple of days with some interest. I coached All American wrestler James Short in soccer in high school. James signed with Clemson University for wrestling, red shirted his first year and during the summer the wrestling program folded and he never wrestled a match for them. He later went to Purdue and now wrestles for the Army. That did not change the fact that a top 5 wrestling program in the country, who was making money, went under because of Title IX. The truth be known, wrestling has been hurt by this law and its interpretation and many more programs will be if the law is not changed. Regarding programs making money, football, etc. It is a myth that the majority of programs don't make money. I challenge that most any program which is successful, in any sport, any level, any sex, will have the potential to make money. There are examples of this all across the board, women’s basketball at a large number of schools like Tennessee, LA Tech, Emporia State, etc.., women's soccer at North Carolina, etc... There are obvious exceptions like rowing, fencing, but I challenge that on any level, if programs lost large amounts of money that the schools from High School through College would drop those programs.

I do know that we all have the right to advocate for change regarding unfair laws or laws that hurt or hinder a particular interest of ours. Since this is a WRESTLING forum, I would hope that most would advocate for change to the law because of the harm done to our sport and it's athletes. While most sports receive the benefit of revenues from Basketball and Football, it is possible to turn women’s volleyball into a profit maker. A part of the coaches’ job is not just winning but marketing or producing revenues. This can be done in a number of ways including, scheduling, community events etc… Simply put, help put butts in the stands, make the money then you will get more money. If you are winning and people aren't coming to watch or are not buying your product, then your product just simply isn't worth it. For those of us who have coached, we will know and admit that we are/were not just coaches but we also had to be business people in order to succeed. Coaches will also know that if you are that good and are producing revenues for the school, then you are in a great place because of your, "fair market value." In other words, shools that can pay more, will, because they will want to lift their own revenues and reputation up.

And the winner of this match by fall, Mr. Westfahl hopefully the lawsuit goes the same way.

Originally posted by Westfahl:
That sounds to me like something that happened during the civil rights movement:
"I am all for blacks being able to enter white establishments, just not the ones I'm in."

--sounds kind of similar to me.

I have a bunch of junk on this forum? Your not attacking title IX your attacking women. I didn't start this post I just thought there were a few people who needed to get a few things straight. And Mr. Westfaul did anyone disprove any of the things I said. No. But in your three posts in a row you actually admitted to wanting to attack title IX which was the only reason I really went this far on this post. Wrestling needs to be helped and revising title IX is where it's at.

I have an idea that will fix all Title IX problems!
Take sex out of athletics! Have all sports open to all sexes and the best athlete plays. If a woman is better at a sport than a male then she gets to play and if a male is better at a sport than a woman then he gets to play. This includes all sports from football, to softball, to wrestling, to gymnastics, etc...
This is the truest form of equality, because this way every person has a fair chance at an athletic scholarship regardless of sex. The BEST ATHLETE really gets the scholarship and the right to play.
This would teach lifelong lessons to athletes; as in the real life the most qualified person gets the job.
Just a thought.

What real life are you living in. The bosses girl friend's second cousin usually gets the job.

Hovpen is that really the best comeback you have?
Reply to my whole idea.

Why
1. requires engaging brain
2. It's Friday
3. Girls already wrestle
4. How the heck did I get in on this, my son got screwed by title nine worse than anyone on here.

I think one of the problems we have in college wrestling is the number of paying fans. I went to the Nebraska vs Arizona State match in Lincoln; about 500 fans. We had two Kansas kids wrestling that night (Murray & Klien)but I only saw a few Kansas people. I'm sure volleyball and softball get more paying fans than wrestling at Nebraska. I don't know all the exact numbers but I know volleyball is sold out when they play in the old barn (approx 6,000) and when they play at Devany Center (over 11,000) As much as I love wrestling it wouldn't take me long to figure out which sport to cut if I were the athletic director.
We all say we are big college wrestling fans, but when is the last time you've been at a match beside the national tournament. When is the last time you've donated any money to the wrestling program of your choice. We all wait until wrestling is being cut from a school, then we want to bitch at the athletic dept of that school. College athletics is and will be more in the future about money. If we want to save our sport, we need to put our money where our mouth is.

Thank you FAN 64. I'm glad there is someone who knows what it's going to take to get wrestling back where it needs to be. Why not stop there. Start promoting wrestling in your school. I know of teachers who gave their kids extra credit for attending after school plays. How about doing this for wrestling. You can key in some factor to make that experience educational. Have the wrestlers lay guilt trips on their friends making them come to the duals. There are many things that can be done but nobody seems to want to take the time and effort to do it.