There are a couple of topics going in the youth forum related to heavier wrestlers (10 & under weight divisions and Why doesn't anyone talk about the Heavyweight Class). The 10 & under topic was generated due to concern for the bigger weight class differentials for the heavier kids. Both topics are connected by the fact that there are just fewer heavier kids wrestling.

I noticed that there are even larger weight differentials in high school (215 to 275) and college (I believe 197 to their heavyweight limit). I know there are a lot of 225 to 250 pound football players. Are some of them not participating due to the fact that they don't want to lose weight to get to 215 or because they do not want to wrestle someone 30 to 50 pounds heavier? It seems like football and wrestling should complement each other. I know football coaches encouraged wrestling when I was in high school. I was interested in seeing what some of you high school wrestlers, coaches and parents thought about this.

This year I came upon that problem. Weighing in at 240 I could have made 215 with a little work and been varsity, or stay at 275 and be behind the number 1/2 guy in the state. I am a much better football player in my opinion, and decided to stay at heavyweight and not lose the weight. I think it more or less depends on the person, and what they want to do. One reason I did not drop was due to the fact I am not an avid wrestler and it took alot of convincing to get me out in the beginning. I think it is great for football players to go out for wrestling, it improves their quickness and agility. I myself also throw the shot put and discus in track and wrestling should greatly help with this.

I think bub has a very valid point. Most of the wrestlers from my school, especially the upper weights do not wrestle year round. They wrestle to help themselves do better in other sports. I know my own son wrestles 215, but weighs around 208, butt naked. The coaches really wanted him to wrestle 189 because they had a heavier kid that could get down to 215, but not 189. He (and his parents) said no way. He also played football and throws shot and disc in track. He was not willing to sacrifice the weight because of the effect it would have on the other sports. I think there are lots of kids out there in the same boat. It would be great to add another weight or two between 215 and 275.

This is an age-old problem for wrestling. My father coached in the 1960s and 1970s and dealt with the same issues.

Especially with bigger kids, I think we as coaches need to promote the idea that whatever the weight difference, there is no better off-season (football) activity than wrestling. Balance, discipline, quickness, and all the rest of the intangibles are aprt of the sport.

Funny thing is, football coaches should WANT their players to wrestle in the off-season. And in many schools, they are encouraged to do so. But while I have seen coaches pay lip service to wrestling, in the background they are saying things like:
"You need to lift every day" (and how many do that?)
"You are required to cut weight and I don't want you doing that" (not true)
"There's too much danger of getting hurt"

We as coaches are generally greedy. We want to encourage kids to participate in as much as possible, so long as it doesn't interfere with OUR sport. All of us need to cooperate with the other sports (well, except for basketball, of course) to get everyone the maximum participation.

Two cents worth:

Lose the 103 class. Add a 235 class.

Tim, I usually agree with most of your posts, but not this one. As a fan, I would rather watch quick little 103lb's and not another weight of dancing bears. Since you are from Manhattan, you know how exciting 103 is for your team (Bingham or Schoenfeld). If you think we need to add a class, go for it but not at risk of losing 103.

I completely agree with adding a weightclass in the 235-240 range. But I do not agree with getting rid of the 103's. If you would have to get rid of a class, possibly bump 103 to 105 and change 112 to 115 and then 119 to 123 and then drop 125. Or some move in that same way. But I would prefer having 15 weight classes with the 235 or 240 class added in.

Folks:

Not making the recommendation lightly. Couple of reasons. 'Smurf' matches can be extremely exciting, particularly because very seldom to the wrestlers stop - but:

1) Many schools - if not most - don't have the atheletes to fill 103. Often it's a bye/bye match or a 5 man Regional.

2) Health of the wrestlers. Too many skeletons standing on the scales at that weight. For almost 30 years that lowest weight class always seems to draw the 'walking dead'.

3) Trade off in number of participants: My presumption (and no, I've got no quantitative or qualitative data to support) is that more wrestlers would be capable of competition at a mid 200 weight class.

4) Preparation for collegiate sports. Again, edge seems to go to a mid-200 class.

What would be most exciting is to take Aaron or Bubba and put them in 200 pound bodies. That would be fun!

Just thoughts.

I agree with adding a 235-240 weight class, but i don;t think there should be any other weights removed. And i don't think that there is always fewer competitors at 103 than in Hvy. In our regional there were only 5 heavyweights, and two of them were 215 pounders who thought they'd have a better chance. It would be cool to see a class of semi-heavyweights, because i'd bet there are some pretty ripped 240 lb. guys out there who don't want to cut, or are stuck wrestling the bigguns.

During football I played weighing about 225 lbs and I wrestle at 215, but i am about 30 lbs underweight too, once wrestling season started I started losing the lbs faster than i could put them on now i wiegh 185 and i seem to do fine for the most part except when i wrestle the good big guys, i can beat the guys that arent the top 5 guys but from there up they seem to be good from size...

Let's face it, Mr. Shea-

Anytime Bubba is involved, it's a party.

I don't know if adding a weight is a good idea or not. On one hand I think there needs to be a 235/240 class to accomodate the fatties, but that's just one more weight class that a lot of schools couldn't fill. As for the football/wrestling connection, wrestling improves footwork tremendously for heavies. It also helps them get to know how to use their weight, which is important in both sports. If I were a football coach I would rather have my fat guys in the mat room than the weight room after school.

I am concerned that if we add a 235 wt. class it will make HWT pretty poor overall and pretty empty. I don't think we want to divide these big guys anymore. Adding 215 was enough and a good football player that is around 235 will most likely end up being a good wrestler if he wants to be.

i dunno about adding another weight class, at most of the tournaments i attend the compatition level and quality of wrestlers is often beter at 103 than at the 215 and 275 lb weight class and the addition of another weight class inbetween those two would only serve to further diffuse the level of compatition and and reduce the # of wrestlers in each weight class. and if you heavyweights are woried about wrestling guys 30 or 40 lbs heavier, it may be in their advantage look at the 4A heavyweight champion last year and Michael Sprigg from norton wo is nowhere near 275 and was 60 lbs under that weight when he took 4th at 4A state last year

As for the original topic, football players as wrestlers:

Wrestling is most definately a good idea for football players. I know that some of my cousins and friends (all of whom won kids state wrestling tourneys and high school state championships/placemenets) set their sights on collegiate football but used wrestling to improve their vital football skills such as quickness, speed and strength. As it stands currently my two friends went on to play college football and my cousins are currently being recruited to play football. I agree that football coaches should continue to encourage their players to go out for wrestling and perhaps track as well. I played three sports in high school and I used the fall and winter sports sesason to stay in shape for my spring/summer sport.

I think one of the points that is being missed here is if more bigger football players will go out for wrestling if there was another bracket (235/240)? I think most are turned off by the idea of wrestling someone that is 30 pounds heavier.
I know if my son weighed 230 and had to wrestle say Adam Venegas who is 250-260, I would discourage him from wrestling.

After coaching high school wrestling for 18 years I would like to summarize the difference (in my opinion) between high school wrestling and football coaches (in general). High school football coaches want to "own" kids. High school wrestling coaches want to "borrow" kids. The high school football coaches who don't encourage their players to wrestle are just hurting themselves. Funny, it seems that all they guys on the field that are "making plays" are the wrestlers. I will take a 185 lb. wrestler on the field against a 230 lber. who does not wrestler EVERY TIME. By the way, I can't wait to hear from my old friend Randy, who has coached both sports for many years on this topic. Sincerely, Eldon Edwards

I think if we are going to add a weight, leave the last weight class unlimited! I think this would bring back a lot of big kids that have been left out since the 275 lb weight limit!

I've got to agree with RJW. An athletic Kid who weighs 230-240 should do very well against most High School Heavyweights. A little bit of quickness goes a long way. As for having to wrestle Venegas, that is only one match. If the kid knows his stuff, he shouldn't get hurt or anything (I've seen alot better/more athletic Heavyweights than him). One of the few matches Jeff Boyle went out of the first period his senior year, was against a kid that weighed about 190-200 tops.Quickness makes up for a whole lot of weight.

One of my sons is 12 and 170 lbs so he has to wrestle heavy weight. Sometimes the other wrestlers way 190lbs. He has a little problem with them out weighting him, but seems to have more speed than they do most of the time. At first he tried to keep it under 165 so he wouldn't be so outweighed, but it was a scary stuggle EVERY week that he may not get to wrestle. We just decided that his body wants to weight 170 and he would just have to deal with the brackets he was put in. There is hardly any kids that wrestle in this weight (at least in the tournaments we have gone to each week), so he has done really well. This is my sons 1st year at wrestling. We have played football and baseball since they were 4/5 yrs old. I've never really watched wrestling until last year. We watched a friend a couple of times, and my kids decided they wanted to try it this year instead of basketball (that was just keeping them active till baseball season) Boy am I a beleiver in the sport now!!! In just the past 3/4 months I have really seen what it has done for my kids, and they love it. The exercise they do in practice has been great for them. You are using ALL your muscles in a match and at practice of course. They have gotten better and better every week, and have replaced the fat with muscle!! They even want to juggle baseball and wrestling over the summer. (I'm not sure they can do that) but we will continue in this sport from now on. It is going to help them in ALL of their sports through college.

moorethan1 has hit on what we really need! More basketball players wrestling!