Whos going to Carlsbad.

Lots of kids will go. The Sothern Plains Camp usually will take close to 100 from the camp. I'm expecting a bigger turnout from the Western Kansas wrestlers because the camp is now located in their backyard as apposed to the location of the camp in the eastern part of the state.

Plus, those kids that got a taste of the camp's development in the eastern half will more than likely travel out west for the camp. I think the eastern half of the state (those that participated) see the benefits of the camp and will continue to be campers. Of course we always have wrestlers that didn't participate in camp that show up for the tourney, I'd say about 25 conservatively.

The Southern Plains camp is a great camp just because the kids are on the mat 3X a day and are focusing on just the Olympic styles. What I've noticed with our club's wrestlers is great leaps and bounds from the "novice" wrestlers (new to the styles) from the end of the season to the day of competition of Southern Plains. Our wrestlers are sold on the camp and have been going for quite some time.

Have your wrestlers look into the camp. It's cheap in comparison of other more notable camps, it's subsidized by USA Wrestling Kansas (driving the cost down), and it's a great way to get your kids around people as passionate as you about wrestling.

I use to be on the staff and was continually impressed with the product we put out at the end of the camp. Kansas as a whole does quite well at the tourney as you can see from the results immediately from placings at the tourney and the national level.

You can also see the it from the quality of high school wrestlers that grew up through the system and their accomplishments. Grater, Cornejo, Baldridge, Deshazer, Knox, Bedore, and others. This is not to say that their coaches aren't doing thieir jobs, but I think the camp does something for the mindset of those that participate. It helps expose them to some of the greatest in the region and coincidentally, we usually beat them.

What their coaches realize is that exposure to other coaches, wrestling partners, and other states, will help them develop even more.

I guess you could say I'm a HUGE advocate of the camp.

Gibby, I am a big supporter of the camp, as you know, this year though, due to location I believe there will be far less from Kansas that attend. Not just Kansas though, but from the Midwest in general. A huge factor, for many like me is cost, even though it is still a "good deal." Between Fargo, National Duals, and everything else the cost adds up and for many, it is just too prohibitive. I know that I am having Nate start officiating to off set some of the costs and all but still don't know as of yet if he will be able to attend the camp, or the Southern Plains Tournament. Shucks we are debating how we are going to do Fargo and Kansas City.

The truth is, that Summer or Spring Wrestling can be far more expensive than what many families can afford. I would say that as of now, the likelihood of Nate attending is poor unless his fundraising efforts become more effective.

I will give credit to our state, they work at finding ways for kids to attend and the officiating monies provided will be some help. I would encourage all kids, Cadet and Juniors, to consider doing this to help with their costs. Every little bit helps, and every opportunity for our wrestlers helps make our wrestlers better wrestlers.

I agree Mike. Stepping up on the regional/national level is a step up in cost. When I first joined the staff, we were traveling to Dallas, TX. It was a miniature vacation for many families as they stayed in Dallas for a couple of days after the tourney. In the second year, we took two busses.

Of course there would be many more at the past two years because it was in our back yard. Eastern Kansas is a fickle group. The didn't mind driving to Chanute because they could finish the trip within six hours, there and back. Will they make the journey now?

Having coached a team in the eastern part of the state, I had an opportunity to take the club to the round robin tourney held in (I forgot the name, the school's mascot is a Rocket). Maximum number of matches, it was a great opportunity to get mat time. I took three kids. The parents just didn't want to wake up at 5:00 am. Eastern Kansas, for the most part, wants their kids to get better as long as they don't have to drive too far.

Western Kansans might be more apt to give it a go. The camp isn't too far in relation to Chanute. They are practicing at a "wrestling school." The tourney isn't too far of a drive.

A side note - I'm concerned about our push for "national dominance" and it's impact on finances of families. Are we really producing a true national elite, or just the one's that can afford it. I'd like to see more done by the board to help defray these costs, Lord knows we have the money in the budget to do it.

I have fought long and hard on this battle with USA wrestling and many others. I believe our numbers from KS will be far down going to Calsbad, NM then you have to turn around 3 weeks later and go to Green Bay, WI. I agree we might have gotten spoiled with the qualifier in Topeka and then Nationals in Enid, but as Mike states most of us cannot simply afford this anymore. In my opinion a "regional" qualifier should be within 8 hours. Many folks at USA wrestling agree. It's rediculous to have a "regional" 22 hours from KC and 5 hours from a major airport. It might be closer for some in west KS, but the majority of our population is in KC or Wichita. My son placed at nationals in all three styles last year and got alot out of the summer wrestling, but there is no way we can make that schedule, afford the time off work, or the finances to two trips like this in 3 weeks. If the regional was closer and you only had Green Bay for nationals as a big trip we would to in a heartbeat. As is you are talking $2500-$3000 for both trips

Here is another thought. This is the only USA nationals without a petition process for last years AA's, etc and such limited qualification locations . Even Fargo has a diverse local qualification process, not just one tournament 22 hours away. I even asked if we could go to another regional and was told that as well.

Just my thoughts,

SlamBam

As a technicality , you are somewhat wrong.

This is the process as I understand it. All divisions below Cadet must wrestle the regional tourney in order to qualify. They can't just pay the fee and sit out. They have to compete. To qualify for regionals, they have to wrestle the state tourney. As a state, that is our qualification. It's up to the individual state. I think it's Missouri that has as part of it's qualification for Southern Plains that they have to go to camp. No camp, no wrestle.

Fortunately for us, we don't have that as a qualification.

For Cadets, they can either qualify by being in the top 2 from the state free/greco tourney, or from placing in the top 3 at their regional. They cannot go to other regionals. Those tourneys are "closed" to any state not within their region.

Juniors on the other hand, can go to other regions and beat kids out. That's why Vegas is such a popular tourney. Aside from the fact that it's Vegas, lots of kids go out there.

As far as the AA's from last year petitioning for a spot, I'm unfamiliar with it. Care to explain how that works?

This was a proposal at the national level to allow AA's from the year before or at this years Folkstyle nationals to petition in to Kids FS/GR nationals. It was asked for because so many like me are complaining about the cost and distance just to qualify. It's little different than having to go to state in Junction City to qualify for the HS age.

The proposal was turned down however as they felt it would weaken the regionals as many top kids would not go (that part is correct) and they would lose money. As this is a major fund raiser for USA they would not allow that to happen. My suggestion was to have more regionals so that no one would have to travel over 8 hours for a regional therefore increasing competition and raising the amount of money earned by USA.

The issue remains for us to have top Cadet and Jr's we must feed top wrestlers into those ages from Kids. And the kids qaulification system is not reasonable for most.

SlamBam

Try wrestling in california like we did for three years. Our qualifier for kids was in AZ and then in Montana for 2 yrs. they had no subsidizing, it was brutal.


i totally agree it is almost totally financially impossible to go to both.

Last season we went to duals in indiana, to southern plains camp, and to wisconsin. We decided early and sacrificed much

Just read FHSU is limiting the Southern Plains camp to 100 wrestlers. So drop my prediction to about 100. Not all the campers will go to the tourney.

I bet you don't have more than 30 go to Calsbad, NM. Just my guess. How many went years ago when it was placed far away? Dallas is only 8 hours away. How many went there?

SlamBam

kanwrman,

You should feel fortunate that you got to travel to the "Big Sky" state. I grew up wrestling in Montana. The real reason they had the tournaments in MT was because when I was a kid and they were in California it took us too long to ride our horses and covered wagons to Denver...just so we could get to an airport to fly to CA.

What's an airport?

I bet you don't have more than 30 go to Calsbad, NM. Just my guess. How many went years ago when it was placed far away? Dallas is only 8 hours away. How many went there?
SlamBam

I think you're shortchanging the numbers. One, as pointed out before, we took two busses to Dallas and you're right, it's only 8 hrs away. But here's some food for thought.

We do very well at the Regional tourney and are consistent in numbers. Remember, not everyone places so there are people that are missing from my totals. I'm only posting the medal winners for each style. I might have them mixed up (my eyes are blurry), but the totals are close to accurate.

Denver - 47 Greco and 46 Free (1999)
Denver - 43 Greco and 47 Free (2000)

Dallas - 39 Greco and 47 Free (2001)
Dallas - 54 Greco and 59 Free (2002)

Topeka - 70 Greco and 73 Free (2003)
Topeka - 62 Greco and 67 Free (2004)

Big leaps in numbers for Topeka and there's a good reason why, it's our home state. All states upon hosting a regional have huge jumps in numbers.

What's interesting is Denver and Dallas. Just supposing that each tourney, the medalists medaled in both styles (quite often the case, but not necessarily), we would have at least 50 attending. But as we know, kids do go to these tourneys and not place. So what would be an appropriate success rate? 50% ? That's rather high, but if that were the case, we'd have close to 100 at those tourneys. Looking at the medalists, many are national wrestlers/AA. Not many will jeopardize a chance at Nationals and sit it out.

I understand entirely the cost issue and I'm not debating it in the least. But to predict such a drop to 30 is probably way pessimistic.

I do see a drop in the Cadet ranks. Our top cadets will wrestle the state tourney and place instead of traveling to Carlsbad. For all other age groups, the only way to get to Nationals is through wrestling the regional.

Mike,

We actually hardly ever flew. Mainly it was to get to Denver, find a stable to take care of the horses and then rent a car to drive the rest of the way.

Side note....back in 1996-1999 I lived in Bozeman, MT. I helped a friend coach the high school team. He brought 3-4 kids down to the Southern Plains regional that KS hosted. From the coach to the parents to the wrestlers, they all had great things to say about the tournament hosted in KS.