I just looked at my notes and it was extremely close between those teams. Reinhart, Little, Curry, Kuipers, Carpenter and Westmoreland would score points on the backside for Derby. As close as those points are, I will look at that again. It does seem like Arnberger and Kriss with titles, would edge them ahead. I know that Feldkamp injury defaulted at Newton after losing to Nelson.

the loss was to patenaude same meet i lost to starnes. and i'm not trying to take anything from burns he's a good wrestler but i was only wondering if he had lost to finney before.

I think the last time I wrestled burns was my freshman year at basor and it was a first period fall.

Feldkamp did default for 3rd and 4th, but not after he lost to Nelson, which means he could have socred 4 more points at Newton. Weren't all those guys wrestling when Colby beat them by 75.5 points at Newton? You say it is extremely close in your notes, but it sure wasn't very close at Newton!

I guess it does not really matter the more thought I give this situation as they don't give out trophies based on your rankings, but it seems to me your credibility as a ranker takes a big hit when you rank Colby behind a team they beat so badly at a major tourney, not to mention Clay Center behind them as well. Maybe that is my Colby bias speaking or maybe it is my common sense that recognizes your apparent big school bias at work??

I don't think that Tank wrestled Basehor his freshman yr. Moore wrestled varsity that yr. I think that the last time he wrestled Vincent was kids wrestling probably in Pittsburg.

oh yeah thats right

FINAL 2008-09 ALL-CLASS RANKINGS!


TEAM RANKINGS:

1. Goddard - 6A
2. Emporia - 5A
3. Colby - 4A
4. Derby - 6A
5. Lansing - 5A
6. Bishop Carroll - 5A
7. Smith Center - 321A
8. Clay Center - 4A
9. Maize - 6A
10t. Abilene - 4A
10t. Wichita Heights - 6A



103
1. Bo Pursel - 9 - LS - 5A
2. Roger Windham - 12 - DB - 6A
3. Aaron Seybold - 9 - PT - 5A
4. Dylan Schumacher - 9 - TM - 321A
5. Colby Watters - 9 - ARK - 5A
6. Hunter Stalford - 9 - CV - 4A
7. Konnor Kriss - 9 - CB - 4A
8. Austin Hood - 9 - LOU - 4A
9. Ty Kolterman - 9 - CC - 4A
10. Luke Cole - 12 - AB - 4A


112
1. Taylor Moeder - 10 - SJA - 4A
2. Alan Callahan - 12 - BAL - 4A
3. Kenneth Ornelas - 12 - CH - 4A
4. Dane Norris - 10 - MH - 6A
5. Uylesses DeShazer - 9 - WH - 6A
6. Isaac Ruiz - 11 - JC - 6A
7. Dalton Miller - 11 - WC - 6A
8. Trevor Boyer - 11 - MV - 5A
9. Bo Newport - 10 - PV - 4A
10t. Nathan Reed - 11 - CB - 4A
10t. Adrian Salas - 11 - LB - 5A


119
1. Nathan Furches - 12 - CL - 4A
2. Zack Tanenbaum - 10 - BVN - 6A
3. Garrett Jones - 11 - ARK - 5A
4. Jake Gentzler - 10 - AC - 5A
5. Jeff Vesta - 12 - MH - 6A
6. Zac Sparr - 12 - RH - 4A
7. Logan Singular - 11 - CC - 4A
8. Dan Weigel - 12 - PL - 321A
9. Zach Hoehn - 10 - WEL - 321A
10. Blaine Smith - 11 - SS - 5A


125
1. Chase Nitcher - 11 - VC - 5A
2. Chaz Lawrence - 12 - OS - 6A
3. Daniel DeShazer - 10 - WH - 6A
4. Zach Peters - 12 - AU - 4A
5. Devon Frye - 12 - EU - 321A
6. Alex Bontz - 9 - WI - 4A
7. Jace Campbell - 11 - OA - 321A
8. Steven Plott - 11 - SS - 5A
9. Tyson Schmidtberger - 11 - RUS - 4A
10. Kyle Johnson - 10 - COL - 4A


130
1. Ryne Cokeley - 10 - SJA - 4A
2. Trent Cox - 12 - MZ - 6A
3. Colt Rogers - 11 - SC - 321A
4. Spencer Blew - 10 - LS - 5A
5. Kash Biddle - 11 - ARK - 5A
6. Dylan Penka - 10 - BC - 5A
7. Josh Umscheid - 12 - AC - 5A
8. Justin Rose - 12 - EMP - 5A
9. Cody Wildin - 11 - MA - 321A
10t. Aaron Geist - 12 - OS - 321A
10t. Trey Houlden - 10 - GD - 6A


135
1t. C.J. Napier - 12 - COL - 4A
1t. Kendric Maple - 12 - WH - 6A
3. Tyler Anderson - 11 - CC - 4A
4. Bryce Hood - 11 - LOU - 4A
5. Danny Floyd - 11 - OS - 321A
6. Sal Tovar - 12 - EMP - 5A
7. Cade Hewitt - 12 - BE - 321A
8. Vance Oliver - 11 - WIN - 5A
9. Beau Hentzen - 12 - BC - 5A
10. Dillon Stucky - 11 - SC - 4A


140
1. Parker Madl - 11 - BV - 6A
2. Cade Blair - 11 - VC - 5A
3. Linwood Peoples - 12 - BVNW - 6A
4. Joey Dozier - 11 - GC - 6A
5. Cameron Jesseph - 12 - CH - 4A
6. Zach Bainter - 12 - NO - 321A
7. Dustin Zahorsky - 12 - SL - 321A
8. Tavo Dikin - 12 - EMP - 5A
9. John Lynch - 12 - LA - 321A
10t. Trevor Oliver - 11 - OS - 321A
10t. Cody Shavlik - 11 - DB - 6A


145
1. Mitchell Means - 12 - GD - 6A
2. Colby Crank - 12 - HUT - 5A
3. Cas Spangler - 12 - BE - 321A
4. Trevor Rempe - 12 - SC - 321A
5. Tyler Davis - 11 - MCP - 5A
6. Jake Walker - 11 - STA - 5A
7. Jake Hattabaugh - 10 - AN - 4A
8. Sam Son - 9 - CH - 4A
9. Quinton Wuthnow - 12 - AB - 4A
10. Chase Sanchez - 10 - EMP - 5A


152
1. Chris Watson - 12 - AC - 5A
2. Nathan Sommer - 12 - PV - 4A
3. Blake Fulbright - 12 - MZ - 6A
4. Ryan Houlden - 12 - GD - 6A
5. Marshall McCall - 12 - SC - 321A
6. Derek Newell - 12 - UL - 4A
7. Tyler Sutherland - 12 - LB - 5A
8. David Lalo - 12 - OE - 6A
9. Reece Wright-Conklin - 9 - LAW - 6A
10. Cullen Demerest - 11 - LS - 5A


160:
1. Tyler Caldwell - 12 - GD - 6A
2. Kyle Detmer - 12 - BC - 5A
3. Travis Rempe - 12 - SC - 321A
4. John Hambleton - 11 - LC - 4A
5. Benny Armstrong - 11 - AN - 4A
6. Ryan Wuthnow - 11 - AB - 4A
7. Corey Engstrom - 12 - HOI - 321A
8. Todd Curtis - 11 - GE - 5A
9. Ethan Mumaw - 10 - JW - 4A
10. Anson Worrell - 12 - BVNW - 6A


171
1. Breck Arnberger - 12 - CB - 4A
2. Alex Feldkamp - 12 - DB - 6A
3. Chase Nelson - 12 - WH - 6A
4. Tyler Hasenbank - 12 - CON - 4A
5. Noel Richardson - 12 - CHP - 4A
6. Grant Hinckley - 12 - LS - 5A
7. Ryan Taylor - 12 - GL - 321A
8. Chaston Hoeme - 12 - SC - 4A
9. Jake Price - 12 - CV - 4A
10. Greg Curtis - 12 - GE - 5A


189
1. Boaz Beard - 12 - GD - 6A
2. Darnell Bortz - 12 - PRT - 4A
3. Aron Elsen - 12 - GB - 5A
4. Nate Davis - 12 - LB - 5A
5. Mark Kolmer - 11 - EMP - 5A
6. Treat Bugbee - 12 - CB - 4A
7. Joel Marrs - 12 - CC - 4A
8. Brandon Reif - 12 - WC - 6A
9. Sawyer Krone - 12 - BE - 321A
10t. Fernando Martinez - 12 - GD - 321A
10t. Jarad Sanches - 12 - SMW - 6A


215
1. Tanner Kriss - 12 - CB - 4A
2. Kyle Caylor - 11 - WNW - 6A
3. Steve Kyler - 12 - ES - 321A
4. Jake Cole - 12 - BC - 5A
5. Jacob Nowak - 12 - STA - 5A
6. Taylor Wuthnow - 11 - AB - 4A
7. Howard Johnson - 12 - GB - 5A
8. Levi Kindel - 12 - CON - 4A
9. Kendall Pierce - 12 - CIR - 4A
10. Jake Woten - 12 - OE - 6A


285
1. Lucas Vincent - 11 - ON - 6A
2. Tank Burns - 11 - COL - 4A
3. B.J. Finney - 11 - AN - 4A
4. Lorenzo Serna - 11 - EMP - 5A
5. Trey Page - 11 - WNW - 6A
6. Jared Rice - 11 - PH - 321A
7. Tony Marquez - 12 - BC - 5A
8. Dennis Devader - 12 - HOL - 4A
9. Cody Huffman - 12 - DO - 321A
10. Dillon Salmans - 10 - HOX - 321A


I will still accept any material criteria that could change these results.

*THESE RANKINGS ARE NOT ASSOCIATED WITH KWCA*

After running through each bracket at State, I have given the edge to Colby and have moved them up to #3. A question for you Rick... What would be the upside for me to have a big school bias? Why would I care how big the school is? Certainly the level of competition comes into play, but especially in 4A that is not an issue. I applied a point system to each team's State placer's and then looked at the strength of the brackets. I just can't imagine someone having a motivated preference for schools based on enrollment and every time I hear that it makes me laugh a bit.

I'm not sure your big school bias is intentional, just a result of where you are, the State tournament you attended, and the schools you watch most of the year. I don't think you have some evil plan to under rank the smaller schools from West of where you live and see all year, it just happens at times in my opinion.

No person on earth is capable of not having some bias in their opinion and I would have never said a word about it except it seemed a little ridiculous that Colby (and even Clay Center) were ranked below a team that they both beat so badly at a major tournament. You are always saying to provide criteria and you will take that into consideration (which you apparently have now done) so that is what I did.

I hope you know that if we had never seen Derby anywhere, I would have never pointed anything out because when there is no criteria, your opinion is what it is and cannot be spoken against. I also want you to know that I am not one of those people who would say "these are a joke" or whatever those people who have no criteria to point to say, but I felt like your ranking said one thing and the criteria said another. That is what I meant by a big school bias (but not an evil plan)!

Chief, its called seizing the moment/or the "15 minutes" of fame. Will not be an issue in the future. Do not lose any sleep over it. Please continue your rankings next year even though your creditibility holds no substance since you are so prejudicial....:)

FINAL FINAL 2008-09 ALL-CLASS RANKINGS!


TEAM RANKINGS:

1. Goddard - 6A
2. Emporia - 5A
3. Colby - 4A
4. Derby - 6A
5. Lansing - 5A
6. Bishop Carroll - 5A
7. Smith Center - 321A
8. Clay Center - 4A
9. Maize - 6A
10t. Abilene - 4A
10t. Wichita Heights - 6A



103
1. Bo Pursel - 9 - LS - 5A
2. Roger Windham - 12 - DB - 6A
3. Aaron Seybold - 9 - PT - 5A
4. Dylan Schumacher - 9 - TM - 321A
5. Colby Watters - 9 - ARK - 5A
6. Hunter Stalford - 9 - CV - 4A
7. Konnor Kriss - 9 - CB - 4A
8. Austin Hood - 9 - LOU - 4A
9. Ty Kolterman - 9 - CC - 4A
10. Luke Cole - 12 - AB - 4A


112
1. Taylor Moeder - 10 - SJA - 4A
2. Alan Callahan - 12 - BAL - 4A
3. Kenneth Ornelas - 12 - CH - 4A
4. Dane Norris - 10 - MH - 6A
5. Uylesses DeShazer - 9 - WH - 6A
6. Isaac Ruiz - 11 - JC - 6A
7. Dalton Miller - 11 - WC - 6A
8. Trevor Boyer - 11 - MV - 5A
9. Bo Newport - 10 - PV - 4A
10t. Nathan Reed - 11 - CB - 4A
10t. Adrian Salas - 11 - LB - 5A


119
1. Nathan Furches - 12 - CL - 4A
2. Zack Tanenbaum - 10 - BVN - 6A
3. Garrett Jones - 11 - ARK - 5A
4. Jake Gentzler - 10 - AC - 5A
5. Jeff Vesta - 12 - MH - 6A
6. Zac Sparr - 12 - RH - 4A
7. Logan Singular - 11 - CC - 4A
8. Dan Weigel - 12 - PL - 321A
9. Zach Hoehn - 10 - WEL - 321A
10. Blaine Smith - 11 - SS - 5A


125
1. Chase Nitcher - 11 - VC - 5A
2. Chaz Lawrence - 12 - OS - 6A
3. Daniel DeShazer - 10 - WH - 6A
4. Zach Peters - 12 - AU - 4A
5. Devon Frye - 12 - EU - 321A
6. Alex Bontz - 9 - WI - 4A
7. Jace Campbell - 11 - OA - 321A
8. Steven Plott - 11 - SS - 5A
9. Tyson Schmidtberger - 11 - RUS - 4A
10. Kyle Johnson - 10 - COL - 4A


130
1. Ryne Cokeley - 10 - SJA - 4A
2. Trent Cox - 12 - MZ - 6A
3. Colt Rogers - 11 - SC - 321A
4. Spencer Blew - 10 - LS - 5A
5. Kash Biddle - 11 - ARK - 5A
6. Dylan Penka - 10 - BC - 5A
7. Josh Umscheid - 12 - AC - 5A
8. Justin Rose - 12 - EMP - 5A
9. Cody Wildin - 11 - MA - 321A
10t. Aaron Geist - 12 - OS - 321A
10t. Trey Houlden - 10 - GD - 6A


135
1. Kendric Maple - 12 - WH - 6A
2. C.J. Napier - 12 - COL - 4A
3. Tyler Anderson - 11 - CC - 4A
4. Bryce Hood - 11 - LOU - 4A
5. Danny Floyd - 11 - OS - 321A
6. Sal Tovar - 12 - EMP - 5A
7. Cade Hewitt - 12 - BE - 321A
8. Vance Oliver - 11 - WIN - 5A
9. Beau Hentzen - 12 - BC - 5A
10. Dillon Stucky - 11 - SC - 4A


140
1. Parker Madl - 11 - BV - 6A
2. Cade Blair - 11 - VC - 5A
3. Linwood Peoples - 12 - BVNW - 6A
4. Joey Dozier - 11 - GC - 6A
5. Cameron Jesseph - 12 - CH - 4A
6. Zach Bainter - 12 - NO - 321A
7. Dustin Zahorsky - 12 - SL - 321A
8. Tavo Dikin - 12 - EMP - 5A
9. John Lynch - 12 - LA - 321A
10t. Trevor Oliver - 11 - OS - 321A
10t. Cody Shavlik - 11 - DB - 6A


145
1. Mitchell Means - 12 - GD - 6A
2. Colby Crank - 12 - HUT - 5A
3. Cas Spangler - 12 - BE - 321A
4. Trevor Rempe - 12 - SC - 321A
5. Tyler Davis - 11 - MCP - 5A
6. Jake Walker - 11 - STA - 5A
7. Jake Hattabaugh - 10 - AN - 4A
8. Sam Son - 9 - CH - 4A
9. Quinton Wuthnow - 12 - AB - 4A
10. Chase Sanchez - 10 - EMP - 5A


152
1. Chris Watson - 12 - AC - 5A
2. Nathan Sommer - 12 - PV - 4A
3. Blake Fulbright - 12 - MZ - 6A
4. Ryan Houlden - 12 - GD - 6A
5. Marshall McCall - 12 - SC - 321A
6. Derek Newell - 12 - UL - 4A
7. Tyler Sutherland - 12 - LB - 5A
8. David Lalo - 12 - OE - 6A
9. Reece Wright-Conklin - 9 - LAW - 6A
10. Cullen Demerest - 11 - LS - 5A


160:
1. Tyler Caldwell - 12 - GD - 6A
2. Kyle Detmer - 12 - BC - 5A
3. Travis Rempe - 12 - SC - 321A
4. John Hambleton - 11 - LC - 4A
5. Benny Armstrong - 11 - AN - 4A
6. Ryan Wuthnow - 11 - AB - 4A
7. Corey Engstrom - 12 - HOI - 321A
8. Todd Curtis - 11 - GE - 5A
9. Ethan Mumaw - 10 - JW - 4A
10. Anson Worrell - 12 - BVNW - 6A


171
1. Breck Arnberger - 12 - CB - 4A
2. Alex Feldkamp - 12 - DB - 6A
3. Chase Nelson - 12 - WH - 6A
4. Tyler Hasenbank - 12 - CON - 4A
5. Noel Richardson - 12 - CHP - 4A
6. Grant Hinckley - 12 - LS - 5A
7. Ryan Taylor - 12 - GL - 321A
8. Chaston Hoeme - 12 - SC - 4A
9. Jake Price - 12 - CV - 4A
10. Greg Curtis - 12 - GE - 5A


189
1. Boaz Beard - 12 - GD - 6A
2. Darnell Bortz - 12 - PRT - 4A
3. Aron Elsen - 12 - GB - 5A
4. Nate Davis - 12 - LB - 5A
5. Mark Kolmer - 11 - EMP - 5A
6. Treat Bugbee - 12 - CB - 4A
7. Joel Marrs - 12 - CC - 4A
8. Brandon Reif - 12 - WC - 6A
9. Sawyer Krone - 12 - BE - 321A
10t. Fernando Martinez - 12 - GD - 321A
10t. Jarad Sanches - 12 - SMW - 6A


215
1. Tanner Kriss - 12 - CB - 4A
2. Kyle Caylor - 11 - WNW - 6A
3. Steve Kyler - 12 - ES - 321A
4. Jake Cole - 12 - BC - 5A
5. Jacob Nowak - 12 - STA - 5A
6. Taylor Wuthnow - 11 - AB - 4A
7. Howard Johnson - 12 - GB - 5A
8. Levi Kindel - 12 - CON - 4A
9. Kendall Pierce - 12 - CIR - 4A
10. Jake Woten - 12 - OE - 6A


285
1. Lucas Vincent - 11 - ON - 6A
2. Tank Burns - 11 - COL - 4A
3. B.J. Finney - 11 - AN - 4A
4. Lorenzo Serna - 11 - EMP - 5A
5. Trey Page - 11 - WNW - 6A
6. Jared Rice - 11 - PH - 321A
7. Tony Marquez - 12 - BC - 5A
8. Dennis Devader - 12 - HOL - 4A
9. Cody Huffman - 12 - DO - 321A
10. Dillon Salmans - 10 - HOX - 321A

They are as long as Windham of Derby is not #1 at 103.

Windham is a great wrestler, but why are the rankings a joke as long as he is not #1. He won in a weak class and was 2-2 against Waters and 1-0 against Seybold. Bo beat the #3,#4 all class in route to win 5A and was 1-0 against Watters and 1-1 against Seybold. To me it could go either way. Obviously I am biased, so if you want to put Windham #1 who cares, but it certainly is not a joke that he is not. To me what you are saying is Bo is a joke and that is offensive for all he has accomplished. I would be fine with your stating you think Windham should be #1, but to post more than once with words like the 103 is a joke is offensive.

I also believe that the top 5 are all within a fraction of each other, that if done all again it could shake out differently. I completely respect all these kids. I am just saying this is the way it shook out, and to say it's a joke takes away from their accomplishments.

Mike Pursel

i agree on badbo because there are alot of weight classes in the rankings that could go the other way

man i really wish we could have a grand state would be great to see some match-ups

to the guy who thinks they are a joke because windham isn't #1-

whats his criteria over pursel? they both went 38-2, they were both state champs, no head to head and no obviously common opponent advantage either way. that ranking is coin flip and it comes down to personal opinion. chief's personal opinion is no more of a joke than yours. the only way you can say these rankings are "wrong" is if you can provide obvious criteria for windham being number one than please do. otherwise shut your mouth.

I think we all know that Bo is totally legit. I certainly do because my son has been in more than one of his brackets over the years. Bo is one of the most skilled and accomplished wrestlers that I have ever witnessed wrestle. I certainly mean no disrespect to Bo. Like I said, Bo is totally legit.
You say that what I said about Windham disrespects Bo and could be offensive. Well do you not think that it would be offensive to Windham to know that he was ranked behind Bo and did not even get a chance to wrestle him and prove otherwise. The thought of Bo being ranked behind Windham should not be an offensive thought to Bo or anyone else also. If it were, then wouldn't Watters and Seybold already be offended.
Bo is a great wrestler. He is an even better kid and I would never say anything to intentionally disrespect Bo. It is not about Bo, it is about Windham.
Additionally of course, the "weak class" comment is very offensive Mr. Pot calling the Kettle Black. I do not see how you could base the ranking decision on Windham being in a "weak class" because that would be absurd. The statement "weak class" itself is absurd. The kid that was 5th in Windham's bracket beat the 4A runnerup. Another kid in the alledged "weak bracket" has beaten the 3,2,1A runnerup and he did not even place in Windham's bracket. Are you prepared to say that those brackets were weak as well? Another kid who was JV this year to the kid who beat the 3,2,1A runnerup mentioned beat a medalist from Bo's bracket 3 times this year. The said 3,2,1A runnerup also beat the 4th place medalist in Bo's bracket. Bo beat Witten 12-7. Did you see what Windham did to Witten at state?
I am certainly sorry now that I said anything. I knew that I should have bitten my tongue because I did not want to start a mud sling. But honestly, I am tired of seeing Windham not get his dues. Yes, Windham lost to Watters but he beat him the last two times and Windham did beat Seybold. If anything, they should at least have been tied and I would not have said anything. I see nothing that would warrant Windham not being #1.
And wrestle007, you can shut your mouth because I already have provided "criteria" for Windham being #1 and I just provided more. I have still seen nothing, "criteria" as you put it, to justify Bo being ranked over Windham. Also, I have seen nothing to warrant the "weak class" comment as well and I also gave results that would refute that.
But again, there was no disrespect or offense intended to Bo. The comments were more about giving Windham his dues. Perhaps I should not have used the "joke" comment but I was quoting someone else. It seemed appropriate based on my feelings about Windham and his accomplishments.
Congratulations to Bo for another Kid's State Title and best wishes at Brute Nationals.
And congratulations to Windham for having a stellar senior year. What a way to go out.

As I stated as well I would have no issue with Windham #1, I was only taking offense to the "joke" comment. We have both said our piece. I have no hard feelings. Good luck to you and your son.

Thank you, you too.

Well, at least that was settled.

same record, both champs, no head to head, no common opponents that decide things...you really think theres any criteria that clearly establishes one above the other?