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Letter from Steve Fraser #146802 04/08/09 11:40 AM
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Mike Juby Offline OP
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I received the following letter from Steve Fraser, former Olympic Gold medalist in Greco, national champion in freestyle and current USAW National Greco Roman coach. As a standout wrestler in all three styles of wrestling (folkstyle, freestyle & Greco) and a dedicated promoter of the sport, I felt it was important to share his thoughts with everyone:
Quote:
What Is Happening To Freestyle & Greco In The Off Season?
By Steve Fraser
April 6, 2009

As I write this article I am watching the 2009 European Championships taking place in Vilnius, Lithuania. The Greco-Roman style is currently on the mat. In freestyle Azerbaijan won the team title beating Russia this year. In the women’s division Russia won the title. And in Greco it looks like Russia will win it too.

As I sit here and contemplate what we need to do as a country to beat these fierce international opponents I can clearly see some very specific things. I can see we need to be very physical in our attack on our feet. It is very obvious to me that the wrestlers who are most aggressive usually have a great advantage. Tiring our opponent out is still a powerful strategy.

From top parterre, we need to be very strong with our particular technique of choice. If it is a gut wrench then we need to be able to gut wrench everyone. From the bottom position in parterre we need to have cement like defense. Our torso needs to be as strong as a tree trunk.

As I was thinking about these technical and physical issues I started to think about our system of training and development as well. What can we do to improve the way we develop our guys? How can we better prepare our youth wrestlers who will grow up to be our future world and Olympic medallists?

As I thought about this I remembered the clinic I did just prior to coming to the Europeans. The clinic was in Grand Haven, Michigan. It was at a USAW youth folkstyle, freestyle and Greco-Roman tournament. I spoke to the kids and parents for a few minutes before I started my technique session. As I was speaking to them I realized that most of the kids and parents did not have a clue that the Olympic Games were not folkstyle. They were not aware that the two styles of wrestling contested in the Olympic Games are freestyle and Greco-Roman.

My thought was “what is happening with our U.S. wrestling system for the youth in our sport?” In Michigan most kids are wrestling folkstyle all year round. What’s happening is – in Michigan (and many other states) there are private wrestling organizations popping up, offering folkstyle competitions in the spring and summer. The current push and focus is on wrestling folkstyle all year long.

This is a vast departure from the day when in spring and summer the only game in town was freestyle and Greco. Back then kids wrestled folkstyle during the high school season and then freestyle and Greco in the spring and summer months.

I am all for free enterprise and I support private clubs or organizations expanding wrestling opportunities for young wrestlers. However, I see a huge dilemma and possible big problem for our World and Olympic future. If kids are only wrestling folkstyle all year - how do we expect to be able to compete with the Russians who have hundreds of thousands of young wrestlers wrestling freestyle and Greco from the young ages of 10 years old and up? Should we be surprised that we don’t win more Olympic medals?

As the National Coach for our U.S. Greco squad I am very concerned. Now, in Greco - we are used to this problem. We have had to deal with this issue for years. But now even our traditionally strong freestyle team might be affected negatively because of this lack of freestyle focus at our youth age group.

How are we going to compete with the world powers of international wrestling like Russia, Cuba, Azerbaijan and others if our youngsters have no experience in these two styles?

Keep in mind Russia has over 200,000 youth wrestlers wrestling Greco and freestyle year round. They have over 15,000 professional training centers and have over 30,000 paid professional coaches all dedicated to training their young wrestlers for international competition.

I assume that all U.S. wrestling coaches and athletes (regardless of what level they are at) take pride in our success internationally in the Olympics and World Championships. The USA has always produced very strong freestyle teams that have made our country proud. And yes, even Greco in the last decade has created an international reputation of being a world power.

How have we been able to do this? Well it starts with our youth coaches and wrestlers. Our youth coaches are the key to our success at the senior level. These fine dedicated coaches that initially inspire our young kids and help them to create the vision of being the best in the world some day are the reason we have been able to excel on the senior level. Learning the basic skills of these Olympic styles is crucial.

I know it is way too adventurous to hope that our high school and college style of wrestling might ever change to freestyle and/or Greco so we might mirror the rest of the planet. I realize this will probably never happen in my lifetime.

But come on… the current situation where kids are wrestling folkstyle during their HS season AND in spring and summer too? Some might argue that we are robbing our young kids of their Olympic dream.

Please realize - besides the Olympic dream issue - wrestling freestyle and Greco-Roman helps prepare a young wrestler to have success in folkstyle as well. In fact most of the high school state champions in Michigan have got a ton of experience in freestyle and/or Greco, according to the coaches I spoke with at the Grand Haven clinic.

Other states will tell you the same thing. Ron Tirpak, who is the USAW Pennsylvania Coaches Director, says “To the best of my knowledge, all the wrestlers who won either an AA or AAA Pennsylvania State High School title wrestled freestyle and/or Greco-Roman during the spring and summer.

So, either way you look at it - wrestling freestyle and/or Greco-Roman in the spring or summer months are a win/win!

I totally respect all of the dedicated high school coaches that are inspiring and training the youth of America. Thank you for this! However, I challenge you to help figure out how we as U.S. coaches, who are all on the same team of helping kids achieve their wildest wrestling dreams, can solve this potential problem. I encourage you to share your thoughts and ideas with me at sfraser@usawrestling.org. Whether you agree or disagree I would love to hear from you.

As always, Expect to Win!

Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Mike Juby] #146808 04/08/09 12:22 PM
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Steve Fraser described a wrestling problem but it is more or less an example of the American attitude. Pompous and arrogant. "Who cares what the rest of the world is doing!" I have seen the same attitude rise up at many of the Kansas Kids meetings. The FS/GR bashers are on our board and we elected them. How many exec board members do you see after folkstyle state? A strong movement starts at the top with good leadership.

Who are we to think that our little country should snub our nose at the rest of the world? We are the ONLY country that wrestles more Folkstyle than either of the other two styles. How great would we be if Freestyle was the primary style?

The rest of the world isn't going to change so we need to support FS/GR wrestling in every way that we can. It starts NOW. If your wrestler isn't playing baseball keep him in a room somewhere in KS for at least two nights a week and take them to a tournament or two. Take them to Towanda and give them a chance to win a Kansas Triple Crown jacket. Take them to Hays to wrestle in Southern Plains. Try out for the Schoolboy, Cadet, or Junior Dual team. We get to take three to five wrestlers per weight, per style to Fargo, ND for the biggest high school tournament in the US. We never take close to a full roster. Lets get our wrestlers more involved! A couple of Olympics back there were five Wisconsin wrestlers on the two Olympic teams. How cool would it be if we could have two or three Kansans?? Support the dream!


Will Cokeley
(708)267-6615
willcokeley@gmail.com
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Cokeley] #146811 04/08/09 12:44 PM
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Ed Wilson Offline
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How or where do kids try out for the schoolboy o cadet teams?


Did you see that Eckenbacherswartzendruber?

Lawrence Elite Wrestling Club
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Cokeley] #146812 04/08/09 12:46 PM
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sportsfan02 Offline
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Originally Posted By: Cokeley

Who are we to think that our little country should snub our nose at the rest of the world? We are the ONLY country that wrestles more Folkstyle than either of the other two styles. How great would we be if Freestyle was the primary style?

Leave it to you, at a time when this country is experiencing a turn towards nationalism, you want to go be more like France?
A lot of Americans just have a preference for folkstyle over FS/GR, does that make them bad people?
For an excecutive council that has "bashers" they sure do fund a lot of FS/GR with folkstyle monies!


Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: sportsfan02] #146813 04/08/09 12:56 PM
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usawks1 Offline
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... that didn't take long! I definitely saw that one coming!


Are you making a POSITIVE difference in the life of kids?

Randy Hinderliter
USAW Kansas
KWCA Rep/Coaches Liaison
Ottawa University Volunteer Assistant
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: sportsfan02] #146825 04/08/09 02:23 PM
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Cokeley Offline
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Originally Posted By: sportsfan02
Originally Posted By: Cokeley

Who are we to think that our little country should snub our nose at the rest of the world? We are the ONLY country that wrestles more Folkstyle than either of the other two styles. How great would we be if Freestyle was the primary style?

Leave it to you, at a time when this country is experiencing a turn towards nationalism, you want to go be more like France?
A lot of Americans just have a preference for folkstyle over FS/GR, does that make them bad people?
For an excecutive council that has "bashers" they sure do fund a lot of FS/GR with folkstyle monies!


Fortunately the "bashers" are usually overruled.

As far as politics are concerned I am quite concerned about the direction we are headed in. The embracing of unionism and socialism over capitalism scares me to death. The excessive printing of US Dollars is making us a laughing stock in the world. We are becoming the modern day Roman Empire. Politically and economically we should be focusing on domestic recovery but not turning a blind eye as to how we impact the rest of the world. You will be hard pressed to argue that it is NOT arrogant for us to think we KNOW BETTER than the rest of the world.

Sport0, you want to talk politics, business, economics? Name the time and place, I will buy you dinner.

Back to wrestling. We need to find a better balance for the international styles. Of course, your arguement will be "Cejudo won a gold medal!" so we are just as good as the rest of the countries of thw world. Just like you always argue that Kansas is top tier when they are not.


Will Cokeley
(708)267-6615
willcokeley@gmail.com
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Ed Wilson] #146827 04/08/09 02:26 PM
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Cokeley Offline
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Originally Posted By: paragoron
How or where do kids try out for the schoolboy o cadet teams?


Contacts:

Schoolboy Dual Team - Tom Willaims wilgt@msn.com

Cadet Dual Team - Russ Hermreck russell_hermreck@usd368.org


Will Cokeley
(708)267-6615
willcokeley@gmail.com
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Cokeley] #146828 04/08/09 02:35 PM
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Ed Wilson Offline
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thank you


Did you see that Eckenbacherswartzendruber?

Lawrence Elite Wrestling Club
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Ed Wilson] #146956 04/10/09 05:10 PM
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ARTICLE II – OBJECTIVES
The objectives of USAWA-Kansas Kids shall be:

1. To create opportunities in wrestling for competitors in the 16 and under age groups along with their coaches and teachers, and to encourage their continued participation in the sport as they advance beyond this level.

2. To place control and direction of the USAWA-Kansas wrestling program in the hands of those who are working in the program.

3. To help develop responsible wrestling administrators from the ranks of the USAWA-Kansas wrestling programs on the local, state and national levels who will provide responsible leadership and direction to their membership.

4. To develop an attitude of sincere concern among all USAWA-Kansas wrestling coaches towards the improvement of all levels and aspects of wrestling from elementary through Olympic levels of competition.

5. To provide channels of communication within Kansas and between the various states, furthering the exchange of ideas and experience, both favorable and unfavorable, so USAWA-Kansas wrestling programs in any area can learn from, profit from, and expand upon the efforts of such programs in all other areas.

6. To assist in developing strong and enthusiastic USAWA-Kansas wrestling programs throughout Kansas, and to assist in those activities which can best be developed on a statewide basis.

7. To develop an attitude of unity within the state of Kansas toward program development and achievement and to increase the positive attitudes of educators, wrestlers and the general public toward the art of science of wrestling.

8. To provide channels for democratic representation in the various national organizations and national activities which involve the wrestlers and coaches of this age group.

9. To establish general patterns of organization and objectives within the state of Kansas, providing continuity of effort as wrestlers and coaches step forward into more advanced phases of wrestling and in turn are succeeded by newcomers to the USAWA-Kansas program.

10. To provide a statewide newsletter and other centrally produced publications of benefit to USAWA-Kansas programs in all areas.


I considered just taking excerpts from this list of objectives found in the Kansas Kids Constitution. However, I find that almost all 10 include language of “improvement of all levels and aspects of wrestling from elementary through Olympic levels of competition.”

Nowhere, that I find, does our “mission” say we should be a “folkstyle” or a “kids” organization only!


Are you making a POSITIVE difference in the life of kids?

Randy Hinderliter
USAW Kansas
KWCA Rep/Coaches Liaison
Ottawa University Volunteer Assistant
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: usawks1] #146974 04/10/09 08:54 PM
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sportsfan02 Offline
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Randy can you show me on that mission statement where it says the funds needed to operate the various styles will come from?


Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: sportsfan02] #146977 04/10/09 09:23 PM
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As I am sure you know, it doesn't mention funding anywhere in the list of objectives!

What they do say ... is "we" shall provide, establish, develop, assist, etc.

Predictably so, I feel it (supporting Summer wrestling) is all part of the Kansas wrestling pie. Granted, "kids folkstyle" provides most of the pie!"

But, are only those that bake the pie, suppose to consume it? How do we divide it? Are there divisions even within the "kids folkstylers" that don't get their share?

Do the 6 and unders deserve a bigger chunk? By simple math, they provide more to the pie than the 14 and unders do! Does a folkstyle club in District 4 deserve the same slice as a club in District 2 that wrestles year round?

Our society is full of examples of disproportion. But each of our members does pay!

Objective two states, we are "to place control and direction of the USAWA-Kansas wrestling program in the hands of those who are working in the program."

I think part of our obligation as members is to demand fiscal responsibility and appropriateness from our leaders. If they fail, then we have avenues to handle them.

These are my feelings ... however, I am certain ... they won't sway your feelings!


Are you making a POSITIVE difference in the life of kids?

Randy Hinderliter
USAW Kansas
KWCA Rep/Coaches Liaison
Ottawa University Volunteer Assistant
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: sportsfan02] #146978 04/10/09 09:25 PM
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Cokeley Offline
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Sports0,

You have advocated not making rules for the sake of rules but not you are asking for specific language (rules)which would mandate where funds are spent? The state body and executive board bring motions forward and create budgets based on the approval of the motions to spend said funds. I know there are some areas outside of folkstyle, freestyle, and Greco wrestling where funds are allocated as well. What are you suggesting? Folkstyle funds should be spend on folkstyle only?

Just curious where you are going with this...


Will Cokeley
(708)267-6615
willcokeley@gmail.com
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Cokeley] #146992 04/10/09 10:43 PM
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John Johnson Offline
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This week I got to talk to a guy from Minnesota who's son wrestled on their School Boy team last year which won the tournament, I believe in both Greco and Freestyle. While talking to him he stated his son had been in Freestyle/Greco practice and doing tournament in such, for the last month or so. He was talking about his kid going to a big Freestlye tournament in Colorado. I told him we just got done with Folkstyle state a week ago. His first comment was 'so you guys are a month behind everyone else'. This made me think, if other states can have their folkstyle season done earlier, and still have kids wrestling in freestyle/greco, I guess Kansas could also. It would be a big change and we all hate change, but think about it for a while. I bet clubs would adapt. The kids would probably like the change, getting to practice something different. The point is, its still wrestling.

Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: usawks1] #147015 04/11/09 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted By: usawks1
Predictably so, I feel it (supporting Summer wrestling) is all part of the Kansas wrestling pie. Granted, "kids folkstyle" provides most of the pie!

I agree and I would suggest that they get a proportionate amount of the "pie".
Originally Posted By: usawks1
Are there divisions even within the "kids folkstylers" that don't get their share?

No, not any longer since some members both on and off the executive council have made sure in recent years that more funds are going towards folkstyle. Thus, we have now, and will in the near future, have a significant shortage of funds to run all of the off-season wrestling.
Originally Posted By: usawks1
Do the 6 and unders deserve a bigger chunk?

YES, they do! Now if we could just sell that to District 1 members.
Originally Posted By: usawks1
Does a folkstyle club in District 4 deserve the same slice as a club in District 2 that wrestles year round?

Yes, because clubs, like people, are all equal.
Originally Posted By: usawks1
Our society is full of examples of disproportion. But each of our members does pay!

Yes, and they should be prepared to pay more, much more. Will the membership be willing to absorb a 5-10 dollar card increase over the next two to three years? I don't know, but if they aren't, some off-season programs will have to be cut or at least severely trimmed.
Originally Posted By: usawks1
I think part of our obligation as members is to demand fiscal responsibility and appropriateness from our leaders. If they fail, then we have avenues to handle them.

I believe our leaders do for the most part demonstrate fiscal responsibility.


Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: Cokeley] #147016 04/11/09 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted By: Cokeley
You have advocated not making rules for the sake of rules but not you are asking for specific language (rules)which would mandate where funds are spent?

I have advocated not making admendments to the constitution to tell us to do something that is currently legal already. I do not ask for any language regarding spending. I do request that the board and our members remember that this is a folkstyle state first and foremost. Thus IMO a proportionate amount of funds should be spent in the areas in which they are earned. Wouldn't doing otherwise be "socialistic" in nature?


Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: sportsfan02] #147081 04/12/09 10:30 PM
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I Love folkstyle personally but i would like to see us switch around the time we spend on it in the united states so we can catch up with the rest of the world team wise in both greco/freestyle....and wrestling freestyle and greco will make u a better folkstyle wrestler...i agree with both sides but more with the broadening of freestyle and greco and we can start it in our state!!!

Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: joshclarktohk] #147241 04/15/09 02:04 PM
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First, the 6 & U division has a great deal of support from several clubs in D1. By today's numbers D1 has about 85 clubs. D2, D3, D4 have about 130. For years the leadership in D1 has fought against having their District, vote as a block in the State meetings. Every club gets to vote what they feel their membership wants. I believe, that is the democratic way!

Second, our charge (even the Kids division) is to support wrestling. You keep talking out-of-season which I assume you mean, April - November!

Every member pays the same fees. Granted our Kids division and our tournament series earns a great deal of the funds that the entire body lives on. Again, examples of that type of funding are prevalent throughout our personal lives and all of society.

Yes, the Kids division has had a greater voice for the past several years in the Corporate meetings. I agree, that the Board is fiscally responsible.

I do think that our entire organization will be much stronger if we actively support wrestling ... that includes Kids Folkstyle wrestling ... but it also includes several other divisions!


Are you making a POSITIVE difference in the life of kids?

Randy Hinderliter
USAW Kansas
KWCA Rep/Coaches Liaison
Ottawa University Volunteer Assistant
Re: Letter from Steve Fraser [Re: usawks1] #147257 04/15/09 05:53 PM
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Something needs to change. I love folkstyle. I wrestled some freestyle and Greco. I even went to Junior Nationals in Fargo. But my preference has always been folkstyle. I believe most of that came from comfort. Summer has always been the busiest time for my family, and traveling to tournements was not possible. I think we need to seriously consider changes that would increase the oppertunities for more kids to be involved in the olympics styles.


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