No, the answer is that they do not allow wrestling after the age of 15. After the magical age of 15, all they have is High School. You are comparing apples to oranges, lets drop the 16U division and then we can compare those states with ours. I don't want to do that either.

Just got off the phone with Wayne Jackson and Greg Buckbee. Both share my opinion that Freshmen, as a whole, can not compete with upperclassmen. There are exceptions, but the majority can not. Apparently Derby's Coach Molloy agrees also. I would sure like for some High School coaches to sound off on this. For or Against....just would like your thoughts.

That is a great argument. How many that are for this change, experienced it first hand. Watching a child go through it does not count. Personal Experience speaks alot louder than, an "Arm Chair Quarterback".

Is it their opinion that Kansas freshman can't compete or just freshman can't compete? Those top wrestling states didn't just say, "Let's not give our 15 year olds a chance to wrestle". They actually BELIEVE its in their best interest to continue wrestling high schoolers or pursue freestyle/greco experience. It wasn't a random draw out of a hat!

So Chad, the wrestlers that experienced wrestling only high school division in Ohio, Illinois and Pennsylvania have a worse perspective than you? You aren't cutting any new ground. They have fully discussed the issue and decided to have their high school wrestlers challenged. Has it hurt them? Is our way better?

Apples / Oranges....Drop the 16U division and lets not accept this proposal. Then we can be like those states that you seem to envy. Wait, we also need to quadruple our states population. Wasn't this your argument at the beginning of this post. I guess I could go back and respond the same way I did then.

And those wrestlers in Ohio, Penn, and Illinois, DID NOT HAVE A KIDS TOURNAMENT TO WRESTLE IN....that is the difference.

Which is better? Wanting to be like them or ignoring them. I am proud of our Kansas warriors and want to raise the standards, not lower them.

They had one when they were KIDS.

I'm not wanting to lower the 14U group...just keep them the same. The 16U division would have it's standards raised. If you want to be like them then we would have to stop wrestling Kids after the 8th grade. That does not seem like the right thing to do....but....Penn, Illinois, and Ohio do it, so should we?

Chief,

Question for you, my son is 14 and a freshman, he is still in jr high, if he doesnt wrestle for a high school this year what division would I enter him in at kids state?

OK. It's been fun...

Even though I really believe that Missouri and others have it right, I can tell that many of us can't take a cold turkey change. As I stated about 20 pages ago, I would not mind a 14U choice for non-varsity freshmen. The best solution goes back to having a true Cadet and Junior division. That would bulk us up for national competition.

Your high school changed the rule this year, so the choice is clear.

Explain...I don't understand you last post Chief.

Lawrence doesnt have freshmen wrestle in jr high anymore, as of this year.

I do believe that this proposal is a big step in the right direction, but with only the small amendment that the 14u freshmen have an option to wrestle 14u, it will be perfectly acceptable to I believe a HEAVY majority of clubs. I can tell you two of our freshmen that won't wrestle the kids state series after HS season. Though I've said many times that a loss sometimes teaches us more than a win, there are going to be lots of kids that say "I have no chance" and are not going to sign up. Am I saying that is the right mentality to have, NO. But if they had an opportunity to win a match or two against 8th graders or other beginner type 14u freshmen, versus going 0-2 at subs against upperclassmen, we have a heck of a lot better chance at getting them signed up. I think Beeson probably should have said "the large majority" of freshmen aren't able to compete with the upperclassmen. And his proposal isn't saying ALL freshmen should wrestle 14u, it only gives the option. It will be a self policing option IMO. If this had been in place last year, and Bo Pursel would have signed up for 14u instead of HS division, his dad, me, and every other coach in the state would have rung his neck. The kids that are capable of moving up to the HS division aren't obsessed with kids' state championships, so they will take on the challenge of teh new HS division.

FYI, The Executive Council and I have received notice from Ned that amendments to main motions will be allowed at the State Body Meeting and if it passes the motion will go into effect this year. This is great news! Thanks to everyone who has shared their thoughts on this issue.

Take care.

well there were 2 motions. 1. the motion for 14 and under wrestling kids state or up? then there was kids wrestling up in weight and age. is that right? and ned said all motions to be voted on at the state board meeting. good work people. so BLT, now is the time to adjust the HWT series. my kid is going on his third yesr of wrestling and never had a chance to wrestle at state series. he weighed over 125lbs at 8 and under. he could travel all over the state and get to participate. but when it comes to subs, he is always done. why? cause you guys cant amend things? the USA govt and USA wrestling amend policies everyday. Cmon, this is AMERICA.. get er done

Dean70,

Because a proposal to adjust the HWT's was not received by the deadline, we will not be able to discuss it at the State Body Meeting. My suggestion would be to get some input from this talk forum, and then send in a proposal during this season while it is still fresh on your mind. The board will then be able to bring it before the State Body next year.

Chad,
Dean 70 and Hossus have been on the fourm for the last 2 seasons (maybe longer) pushing for change in this area. People have told them that it would be discussed and then they issue of "oops" we will get to it next time because of "blah blah blah"!
I think people need to be better educated on our processes and there needs to be postings made a month or so before the meetings deadlines. Not on the Friday night before the Sunday deadline like I think has been done in the past.

I know this thread isn’t the right place to post this and will keep this quick.

Lance, you are exactly correct! There needs to be better education of the process and more transparency from top down. I am talking about being proactive and encouraging questions and then responding in a timely and informative way! From my recent experience I can understand why so many may begin but are quickly discouraged and give up. I honestly believe we have some of the brightest folks of any state, with great ideas, but are intimidated by the process and unknown. This forum provides a great starting point to explore ideas, get input etc etc. It also provides an excellent way for our leaders to proactively share knowledge!

More to come on another thread.

At some point I want to be introduced to the person or persons NOT declaring Kansas one of the "top wrestling states". I have a real bone to pick with them!