There are two separate recent posts that kind of address this issue and possible solutions. District 1 Accomodations & Tournament-Topmiller 3/24 12:31AM and State Tournament Schedule-? for Mike Juby-Cokeley 3-23-2002. If you are interested in this subject you might want to check out both posts and contribute to the discussion and hopefully a good solution.

Topmiller's problem was at District 1 last year and mine was at State last year as described in Cokeley's post on the State Tournament Schedule. I think the common element is though that these tournaments are probably too long and somehow need to be changed.

I have probably suggested the most radicial proposal. I think we need to consider dropping the 6 & under from district and 16 and under from all Kids competition. Maybe that is too radical. You can read my reasons in the Topmiller post on district 1 accomodations. A couple people suggested dropping some weight classes in 14 & 16 and under. One person suggested making District a two day tournament with the 14 & 16's on the second day.

I think shortening these tournaments is a very worthy goal. I thought about not bringing it up until next week after State. I hope it doesn't distract from this week and what it is about for the kids, coaches, and everyone else involved. I'm only bringing it up so strongly now because I know many of us will not be on this site after this weekend's tournament and I really believe it is a topic that needs to be addressed and changed.

As a parent I want to thank all of you coaches, referees, tournament directors and officials who work so hard for our children. I hope you understand that none of us who are bringing up this topic do not appreciate your tireless efforts. We just want to try for a better overall situation and our offering our best ideas on it.

Next year you won't have to worry about the 6&U Championships at your District Tournament because they won't be mandantory. Each District will have a choice if they want them or not.

Next year District II will have a 6&Under State Championship Tournament a few weeks before Districts. (in the works)

Also if they would go to High School weights & Middle School weights that would shorten them a little.

What makes you think that the district tourneys are too long? Many times when a tournament last for long periods of time it is becuase: 1. the site hosting the tournament doesn't have enough space for enough mats? 8 mats is not enough for a district tournament. 2. The tournament is poorly run, this includes multiple calls for scratches, unruley coaches and parents who cause long arguemtns over officals calls, not starting on time, ect. ... While im on the subject I would like to mention what a wonderful job the Geary7 County Wrestling club did in hosting the district 3 tournament. It was ran very smoothly and I beleive most of it was over by 5:00. I don't believe cutting age classes is a great idea at all and I think I speak for everyone in my club when I say this. IF you can't handle a whole day of wrestling then perhaps your loyalties should be in another sport that is not as time consuming

Mr. Isom, on your question on what makes you think tournaments are too long? Part of my question had to do with Topmiller's post about his experience in Ottawa this weekend that I referenced to at the start of this post. It appears that Ottawa did not have as good a finishing time as District III. My second reason was that too long of a tournament was part of the explanation that was given to me last year from the State tournament officials when I expressed my family's frustration about the fact that our son after losing his first match had to wait until at least noon to find out he would not wrestle again until the next day. The winners went on to wrestle 2 more times that day before he was able to wrestle his second match the next day. They said it was set up this way partially to cut the time needed on the last day of wrestling at State. Personally we did not have a bad experience at Ottawa this year since my son is in 10 & under and he was in the morning session. I would not have wanted to experience what Topmiller did though.

I thought you gave some great reasons why they can become so long and correcting those things would be part of the solution. I can say though that I do not argue with referees (I've been a referee in another sport and I know it is a tough job) and my son is always at his mat on time for his matches.

As far as the age classes, my question is really do 16 & 17 years old (sophomores & juniors) really need to be practicing and competing at the same events as these younger boys? I can see them coming to help coach the younger boys at the end of their high school season if they would like to keep involved. But do they really need to compete at the same events? I know once my high school sports seasons were done that I was ready for them to be over. I really would not have wanted to be competing at events that young kids were at. However, I did not wrestle in high school and we did not compete in one sport year around back in 1969 when I graduated. I definitely could be wrong about it but I do know three good wrestlers who would be in this group who have chosen not to wrestle in Kids and two of them are doing freestyle this spring and summer.

I definitely do not completely agree with your last statement about if we can't handle a whole day that we should find another sport. Do we want to lose new wrestlers and their families? I think there is room for families who believe in a more moderate approach and do not devote as much time as many of you who coach and administer our sport.
Sometimes, I think someone who is not as involved in an activity can give a new insight into the activity. You may be right for my family and maybe I should just have my son wrestle in just a few local meets at this age and not go to Salina, Topeka, Wichita and the State tournament playoff system. This is his sport though. This is the only organized sport that he has participated in and stuck with. He has won 10 of his 11 meets and lost just one match this year, and I would not want to take that opportunity away from him. But maybe that might really be the decision we ultimately need to make as a family. Limiting him now would probably hurt him in high school if he choses to continue with wrestling, but he could probably still do it.

I guess I do not agree with most of your reply, but I do appreciate that you did take the time to post a reply to the topic. Thank you.

I worked a table for Dist I's afternoon session and we were 10 matches behind the other mats. The reason... We had a 1/2 mat for 14&Under kids weighing between 100 & 130. I kept track and we were averaging about 5 breaks per period for out of bounds. In addition, we wore two referees out to the point that they couldn't get between the wrestlers and the floor/table. The minimum mat space around the edge was neglected. Someone is going to get hurt if the practice of using and undersize mat is continued. Why not have the 6 and under District tournament the weekend before. The season is too long for most little guys anyway. I agree with having a neutral site hosted by many clubs instead of one club. In District I we have Johnson County Girls Athletic Center, Free State High School, KU, Johnson County Community College, Washburn, etc. I know there are similiar facilities in every district.

There has been much criticism about last weekend so I don't want to leave another post without thanking all those who tried to make the tournaments work out. The state as whole is to blame not any inidividual clubs.

Husker Fan I appreciate your concern. I have posted a reply on my original post to some of the comments that were made. I have also made a few suggestions that I hope will help get people thinking about this issue. As I have stated on my last reply in my post I do appreciate all the individuals that have helped put these tournaments on. I would like to thank them all for their hard work and dedications. Hopefully we can start the thinking process now instead of in October to improve this great sport.

I agree with you Topmiller. I think now is the time to start the topic and come up with ideas and not wait until October. I think you have started that process. I could tell from your first post that you were just as frustrated with your experience at District as my family with our State experience last year. At least you have started the topic rolling in this forum. We are getting some feedback on the posts. Of course not all of our feedback is in agreement with our opinions. That is okay though. I know you don't seem to agree with my idea to consider not wrestling the 16 & under division. So far no one else has supported that idea either. They are calling for eliminating some weight classes which could be helpful.

I notice too that someone is conducting an informal poll on the State tournament format this year (whether to have 2 frontside matches and then
a backside match like in the year's before last year, or 3 frontside matches first and then the backside like they did last year). Everyone so far was voting for the 2 frontside, 1 backside option. I found that encouraging because that is exactly what my my problem was with last year's tournament. Maybe something like that will have an effect.

Good luck to you and your family this weekend, Topmiller!

FYI ... There were 1260 matches held at the District 1 tourney in Ottawa. (A breakdown is posted in the other thread about accomodations)
Granted, some were scratches and some 5th place matches that no one showed up for. But a heck of a lot of matches to hold regardless.