Hey John Steiger....YO!...Long time brotha...Anyhow, I'm getting a kick out the age old argument - Who's better? It changes every year, at every location. So and so beat so and so who lost to so and so, and he beat so and so who placed better than Ferris' cousins third nephew out east, who got smoked in a tourney out west. ANY GIVEN DAY...thats why wrestlers train, sweat, work.

Someone posted a comment about literally half of all 6A wrestlers qualify for state....try telling that to 120 athletes killing themselves in Garden City's hot matroom in the late 80's/early 90's! Those days were spent competing from St Francis to Newton to , of coure the GC Invite. Any trips to state from there were well earned, irregardless of perceived regional toughness!

Talent transcends location, so do the head scratchers. Without a true All State tourney, all these argumemts are moot. Good luck to all the state competitors, where some may indeed have been 'giften in', but the placers will have 'earned' it!

Everyone keeps beating up on 5A and 6A.

Have never gone out west to watch 321A, but have seen several eastern 321A achools in east Kansas big tournaments. Seldom see a first place wrestler or team from the 321A schools. One, they don't bring a full slate of wrestlers, and two seldom are they competitive as wrestlers from the bigger schools. Wrestlers from the bigger schools wrestle the better competition, if not in their wrestling rooms, then in their leagues, then in the bigger and better tournaments (B/L Bobcat, Baldwin BIT, Emporia Invit.--and even some very good tournaments hosted by 4A schools (Louisburg, Holton). Additionally, the small school wrestler-especially at the lighter weights--may be 2 or 3 years younger and/or 2 or three grades behind the big school wrestler.

An example with another sport. I like to watch the state champioship 8 man football games. Lots of action and lots of points. But, 125 and 130 fresmen or sophmore guards and running backs. Normally only 2 or 3 kids of size on an 8 man team--the center, the QB, and maybe a receiver. Compare that to JC, Manhattan, Olathe North with 230 lb guards 210 running backs, 260 tackles, etc. Big schools, more kids, older kids, more bigger kids with more experience as they come up through 9th, 10th and JV FB. Can draw similar conclusions and comparisons with small school and big school wrestlers--and yes some of those 125 and 130 321A footballers are or may develop to be very good wrestlers--but against bigger school kids the numbers are against them.

I can hear the rumbles out west heading this way.

Contrarian, come out west and spectate.

Yeah, sure Greg can get Lansing signed up to wrestle in the Norton Tournament next season. Mill Valley makes the trek out west maybe you could hitch a ride with them.

i've been there and seen it, certainly tough. would i say it's tougher here than anywhere else, certainly not. there no way to make that judgement. have family all around up there (mankato, courtland, jewell, formoso). i've been to norton football games, wrestling matches, and basketball. my dad makes the trek every year to watch smith center vs norton each year with my uncle. their tough, no doubt in all sports, but i would never say one class or area is tougher than the rest. because it changes year in and year out. watched my cousins (pike valley) f-ball and b-ball team play, had 2-3 juniors who were over 6' and 200lbs, one was like 6'5' 230lbs, i thought man these guys won't get beat in 8man, sure enough they did. a little school down here in my neck of the woods happened to tear through everyone in those days, st. paul.

it's all fun to talk about and speculate, but some folks put all their eggs in one basket, stats. i'm not at all implying that's what YOU meant GREG. just sayin' some people read way too much into things. GOOD LUCK TO ALL 6 OF THE NORTON FINALISTS AND THE REST OF THE BLUEJAYS. they appear to be putting on a clinic.

Why should I come out west. Why not bring Norton or some other 321A schools back east to some tournaments. I am sure they could get in the Bobcat or the BIT or the Emporia Invit or Holton. Back here you will get a real good mix or 6, 5, and 4A competition. If the small schools want to certify their standings then they need to hit the roads and come to the competition. What I read in the FORUMs about out west is mainly Johnny beat Joe but Joe beat Charlie, and last year....... Don't think I have ever read a 321A tournament results---especially with any bigger schools in attendance. Face it--bigger schools have nothing to gain by traveling out west--and possibly a little to lose. Conversley, small schools have a lot to gain by comming east and nothing to lose (a good showing here will be recognized and a poor showing will go un-noticed). So, load up and come on over!!! You boys out there are always talking, but you are going to have to back your words with action back here where we can all see it.

Other than Norton and Smith Center, I don't know where the 321A schools and towns are--have to get a big road map.

Contrarian,

We wrestle at Clay Center and Newton. In 2007 when we got "weathered" out of the Newton Tournament we took part in the Emporia Dual Tournament, and won it. I would say we are holding up our end in regards to seeking "out of area" competition--while staying within a budget and guarding against loss of school time.


"Other than Norton and Smith Center, I don't know where the 321A schools and towns are--have to get a big road map."
Too bad for you.

Head up:

Contrarian said: "Have never gone out west to watch 321A. . ."

I said, "Come out west and spectate."

It was an invitation to come "out here" and watch some good small school athletics. Nothing was said about anything or anyone being better.

I forgot Lucas, how did you do at state?

Until someone puts the effort, as they have into this post, into fixing the KS school class system or a grand state, this debate will go on forever and KS will still not receive credibility for wrestling.