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 Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: badbo]
#168016
04/08/10 06:22 PM
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,326
Cokeley
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It is ironic that the public school educators are so uneducated.
Will Cokeley
(708)267-6615
willcokeley@gmail.com
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: Coach Davies]
#168017
04/08/10 06:27 PM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 844
WillyM
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Sumner Academy is a USD 500, KCKS inner city, 5 year public HS. USD 500 tests all 7th graders. Students who score high enough, and have no history of discipline problems, are invited to attend Sumner. Failure to maintain the required grade point, or to be a discipline problem, get the student sent to his KCKS neighborhood HS. Sumner student ACT and SAT scores are on a par with Shawnee Mission and Blue Valley Districts
The student body is about 40% Black, 40% Hispanic, and the remaining 20% white, Asian, and others. The school is in down town KCKS in the old Black HS.
The Curriculum is heavy in math, scienc, and English. Most of the students are enrolled in IB or AP programs. Sumner has been recognized nationally by U. S. News and World Report 6 or 7 times in the last 10 years as a U. S. Top 100, Gold Medal School. Great school and great kids.
Sumner is not a 4A sports power. The are pretty good in football, and tough every year in basketball (4A boys State BB champs in 2000 and 2010)(remember, these are inner city kids in inner city sports). In other sports they are spotty to very poor!
See no reason they should be bumped to 5A.
Last edited by Contrarian; 04/08/10 06:33 PM.
Bill Mason Lansing
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: Cokeley]
#168019
04/08/10 06:43 PM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 844
WillyM
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It is ironic that the public school educators are so uneducated. . Please explain your comment, an if applicable, refer to the comment/educator you are criticising. Yelling fire in the movie theater make no sense!! Contrarian Had to use a dictionary for criticizing--criticising! I wish RichardD would hurry and get us--me --a spell checker.
Last edited by Contrarian; 04/08/10 06:52 PM.
Bill Mason Lansing
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: WillyM]
#168022
04/08/10 07:00 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 201
shudog
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Why does it matter if they are good in sports or not? Moving private schools up a class applies to all the private schools, good and bad in any sport. Still wondering if private schools are moved up, will the public schools with students outside there district also be moved up? As the Baseball coach at TMP, we have struggled at 3A the 2 years I have been the coach with a 13-27 record. Our football team won 1 game last year and the basketball team was below .500. We have over 70 international students that don't even know what a football or basketball are much less knowing how to play the sports. Some people fail to see the big picture. There are great teams, both private and public. As our principal, Mr. Dewitt stated earlier, we will continue to tell our student athletes to work hard and do what it takes to win, no matter where we are put.
Brian Schumacher
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: badbo]
#168025
04/08/10 07:28 PM
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,916
sportsfan02
OP
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OP
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I do think if schools are beating you, get out and outwork them, regardless of size.
If that is the case then why do we have divisions for any sports? Why not play 6A against 1A? To take it further, why have weight classes in wrestling? If the 03lber wants to work hard enough he can beat the 215# stud.
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: sportsfan02]
#168030
04/08/10 08:33 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3
Tom Klotz
Junior Member
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A side note regarding Sumner Academy: It could be said that, athletically speaking, they are already at a bit of a disadvantage compared to most other schools in the state. As Contrarian mentioned, the students are required to maintain a minimum GPA (2.5 I think - I could be wrong), or they must attend another school. Behavioral issues are treated similarly. The resulting attrition rate between 8th and 12th grades is approximately 50%. The number of freshmen and sophomores who attend school there greatly exceeds the number of juniors and seniors, and the composition of their athletic teams reflects that. The upside is that Sumner Academy is a terrific college preparatory environment for kids who are disciplined and motivated. When you see one of their teams take the mat/court/field, you can be assured that you are looking at a high quality group of kids.
FYI: U.S. News and World Report has them listed as the 62nd best high school in the country this year.
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: WillyM]
#168046
04/09/10 12:14 AM
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,326
Cokeley
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It is ironic that the public school educators are so uneducated. . Please explain your comment, an if applicable, refer to the comment/educator you are criticising. Yelling fire in the movie theater make no sense!! Contrarian Had to use a dictionary for criticizing--criticising! I wish RichardD would hurry and get us--me --a spell checker. The need to blame the lack of success by public schools on private schools. Instead of digging in and seeing why teams or individuals REALLY excel lets just say it is because they can get students from a larger populous, which by the way is very false. Many public schools permit out of district transfers, are we going to hit them with a multiplier? It is just more class warfare. The have nots want to blame the haves instead of working harder to become the haves. That is the American Dream. The Frontier League and NCKL want to "level the playing field" by pushing the top down instead of pulling the bottom up. Instead of rules, regulations, and policies that they HOPE will make things fair they need to be teaching our youth that life isn't about fairness. It just isn't. The educators in the public school systems, in general, only know how to spend tax money. They are inefficient government mechanisms burdened by increasingly liberal philosphies. Instead of leveling the playing field they are going to polarize the communities. I got an email yesterday from the DeSoto school district requesting feedback on a superintendent search. My answer "Lets go without one!!" Heck we could use that $150,000 plus to hire more teachers, fund sports programs and help our students. Public schools are burdened with TOO MUCH overhead because the educators are by-in-large uneducated.
Will Cokeley
(708)267-6615
willcokeley@gmail.com
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: sportsfan02]
#168052
04/09/10 01:30 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,143
HEADUP
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I do think if schools are beating you, get out and outwork them, regardless of size.
If that is the case then why do we have divisions for any sports? Why not play 6A against 1A? To take it further, why have weight classes in wrestling? If the 03lber wants to work hard enough he can beat the 215# stud. i've seen a 125lber and 135lber beat a state placing hwt. just sayin. 6a vs 2a in football would be bad, but i think wrestling and that other winter sport would be ok, even track and baseball. certainly golf, cross country, tennis, etc. great idea, it would bring credibility to ks sports. especially if a 1/2a beats a big school, wow.
"with attitude, will, and some spirit"
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: Cokeley]
#168053
04/09/10 01:30 AM
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 933
Brent Lane
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Will,
Have you stepped in a public school classroom in recent years. What qualifies you to say public school educators are uneducated? Are you just being a snob with your expensive private schools The way you make it sound public schools should bow down to your superiority? It's absurd what you are saying here. Public school kids work just as hard but because some would have parochial schools bumped up a class due to what many feel are an unfair advantage you lash out calling them liberal and uneducated. This has got to stop. Stop crying foul when you have the best of both worlds. The options you have are not available to everyone. The parents that care about their children make sacrifices for the betterment of their children, you are not the only one. Peter Sierant from KC Turner sent this to me:
"If I took the worst ten percent of my school off the list of enrollment and replaced them with an elite ten percent, everyone would benefit. Public schools have not choice. Private ones do. Think of our athletic programs if we eliminated the worst 10 percent and replaced them with an elite 10 percent; for wrestling that would equate into a team trophy at state."
By the way Pete attended Rockhurst High School [1985] and teaches for an at-risk school district. There is a disparity.
I can't speak for all public schools but I know I bust my butt to make my kids better which includes working the kids hard, it's not just a religious puritan work ethic held exclusively to private religious affiliated schools.
We can agree to disagree on some things but when you call public school teachers uneducated you show your disdain for the public schools. You of course have that right to that opinion but please don't lump us all (by-in-large) under this category because you are wrong.
"If it is to be, it is up to me!"
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: Brent Lane]
#168065
04/09/10 04:29 AM
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,326
Cokeley
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,326 |
Will,
Have you stepped in a public school classroom in recent years. What qualifies you to say public school educators are uneducated? Are you just being a snob with your expensive private schools The way you make it sound public schools should bow down to your superiority? It's absurd what you are saying here. Public school kids work just as hard but because some would have parochial schools bumped up a class due to what many feel are an unfair advantage you lash out calling them liberal and uneducated. This has got to stop. Stop crying foul when you have the best of both worlds. The options you have are not available to everyone. The parents that care about their children make sacrifices for the betterment of their children, you are not the only one. Peter Sierant from KC Turner sent this to me:
"If I took the worst ten percent of my school off the list of enrollment and replaced them with an elite ten percent, everyone would benefit. Public schools have not choice. Private ones do. Think of our athletic programs if we eliminated the worst 10 percent and replaced them with an elite 10 percent; for wrestling that would equate into a team trophy at state."
By the way Pete attended Rockhurst High School [1985] and teaches for an at-risk school district. There is a disparity.
I can't speak for all public schools but I know I bust my butt to make my kids better which includes working the kids hard, it's not just a religious puritan work ethic held exclusively to private religious affiliated schools.
We can agree to disagree on some things but when you call public school teachers uneducated you show your disdain for the public schools. You of course have that right to that opinion but please don't lump us all (by-in-large) under this category because you are wrong.
Uneducated on this particular topic. The advantage isn't as defined. The advantage comes from those who choose to send their kids to a private school not from wider population base. The penalty of a multiplier is unjustified and "uneducated". It is an overreaction. Furhermore, you know as well as I that there are public schools with programs that attract kids from outside of their district. What are we going to do about those? Olathe has open enrollment so kids can attend any of the Olathe schools are we going to give them a multiplier too? The point is that the penalty suggested is not all inclusive. Private schools just become an easy target. I don't disagree with what you or Pete say but that issue is more of a rural versus metro area issue not a public versus private. I know kids who went to Southwestern Heights instead of Liberal even though they were in the Liberal school district but no one is looking to apply a multiplier to Southwestern Heights. Any program that has success will attract student athletes from outside of their normal boundries. Don't just single out private schools because you feel they are an easy target. If you think that is ok then I want a 100% tax credit for the property taxes I pay that I don't get to utilize. Again, you neglect to admit that a clear advantage to the public schools is that they receive ALL of the tax dollars paid by parents who send their kids to private schools and don't consume a single dollar of those resources. Argue that Brent. The classification system isn't broken, the public school system is. You cannot punish the private schools because you don't operate as good of a system. That is ridiculous.
Last edited by Cokeley; 04/09/10 04:31 AM.
Will Cokeley
(708)267-6615
willcokeley@gmail.com
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: Cokeley]
#168073
04/09/10 11:34 AM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 844
WillyM
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Posts: 844 |
What I find ironic about Cokely's ironic statement, is, I will bet, that a review of the transcripts of parochial school teachers would reveal that they are graduates of the same college and university schools' of education as public school teachers. Have known a few of each and most are not uneducated. Have known a few of each who were certainly graduates of Way Below Normal (do you even know what a Normal is/was?).
Cokely rants about pubic school administration and its costs. My understanding is that the higher level administration for Catholic schools is at the diocese. How many people that is I have no idea. Doubt the Bishop does it by himself!
Last edited by Contrarian; 04/09/10 12:15 PM.
Bill Mason Lansing
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: WillyM]
#168076
04/09/10 11:51 AM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 844
WillyM
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Cokely wants his tax dollars back. Another try for public funding of private schools.
How many parishes credit parish donations to the catholic school tuition of the students whose family made the original donation to the parish--and the parents then claimed the parish donation as an itemized income tax deduction. Have catholic friends who told me this common.
A few years back our local 6A public high school had an outstanding advaced studies program--assume they still do. Thinking I might want to become a teacher after a change of careers, I monitored several of these classes. They were discussing "stuff" I had not seen in college math, chemistry, and biology. Students at the local Catholic HS attended these AS classes, plus other classs subjects not presented in their HS. No objection to their attendance, parents paid taxes--but do not think the district got credit for them for the State allocation.
Last edited by Contrarian; 04/09/10 12:16 PM.
Bill Mason Lansing
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: WillyM]
#168077
04/09/10 12:09 PM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 844
WillyM
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So Olathe has an in-district openenrollment policy. So what? Tell us which Olate School has a virtual sports dynasty in any Sport. Perhaps Olathe North in football. But still not every year nor the dominance of STA in soccer (boys and girls), SJA in soccer and volleyball. And it is not just State championships, it is the number of private schools in each class who fill up the district and state level brackets. In an 8 team bracket in team sports--2, 3, and perhaps 4 of the qualifers will be private schools. If private schools make only 6+ percent of KSHSAA member schools, 2 of 8 qualifers is 25%, 3 is 37% and 4 is 50%.
Something is not right in Denmark!!!! (Shakespeare for all you other public school dummies--dam--was that from Hamlet or King Lear).
Last edited by Contrarian; 04/09/10 12:17 PM.
Bill Mason Lansing
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: WillyM]
#168078
04/09/10 12:44 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 201
shudog
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Contrarian, same thing applies to ALL Private schools. Not all of them are virtual sports dynastys but you want to pentalize all of them. Do you realize the size difference this will cause by moving the private schools up one class? If this happens, Junction City- St. Xavier 19 students in 10th, 11th, and 12th grades, Beloit St. Johns with 22 students, Hutchinson Central Christain 25 students, Elyria Christain 46 students, and Lawrence Bishop Seabury with 46 students would be moved to 2A with a range up to 120 students. Current 4A private schools like KC Bishop Ward with 210 students and Wichita Trinity with 245 would be moved up to 5A with a range up to 977 students. And in 5A, SM Bishop Miege with 531 students would be put in 6A with a range up to 1558. Many other of the private schools have the same differences, just not as bad. This looks really fair! If the arguement against private schools is that they have no boundries, then for the third time, would the multiplier apply to any school, private or public, that has students outside their district?
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: shudog]
#168080
04/09/10 01:02 PM
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,916
sportsfan02
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Posts: 2,916 |
then for the third time, would the multiplier apply to any school, private or public, that has students outside their district? I don't think anyone is answering your question because they know you already know the answer.
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: sportsfan02]
#168088
04/09/10 01:33 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 690
windjammer
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Brian,
First, if out of district kids was the only issue, nobody would care.
Second, I believe they are talking about a multiplier, not necessarily moving everyone a classification. For example, multiplying your enrollment by 1.4 to determine your classification. That would keep the Elyria Christian type schools in 1A.
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: shudog]
#168090
04/09/10 01:41 PM
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 76
mfe
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Will. The same people who want to "level the playing field" are the ones who are against school vouchers. The NEA (democrats)has fought vouchers for years. That would do more to hold parents and teachers accountable and raise the quality of our schools than any of this garbage we are talking about. As we catholic's know, ALL catholic's contribute to the Diocese they live in whether you have children or not and the Diocese spends this money on all kinds of charities, homeless, foodbanks, and schools. There is NO requirement to donate. By some's remarks, they feel the deductability of these deduction are somehow sinister. Yet, try to take away the deductability of the real estate taxes and their charitable deductions, they scream bloody murder. Will, I agree. It's a waste of time to try and educate someone with a closed mind. But, I appreciate you trying. Thanks, Matt
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: mfe]
#168092
04/09/10 01:58 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,440
Chief Renegade
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Good post mfe. That same group is for taking the life of the innocent and saving the life of the guilty.
Eric Johnson
Acts 4:12
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: WillyM]
#168093
04/09/10 02:03 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 180
Bender
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Posts: 180 |
Cokely rants about pubic school administration and its costs. My understanding is that the higher level administration for Catholic schools is at the diocese. How many people that is I have no idea. Doubt the Bishop does it by himself! Opp looks like we need another look at this one... and i dont think spell checker would save you this time
Last edited by 5647893; 04/09/10 02:05 PM.
Bite my shiny metal @$$
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Re: Would somebody please get Cokeley a sedative
[Re: Chief Renegade]
#168094
04/09/10 02:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 690
windjammer
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Posts: 690 |
This has nothing to do with religion and abortion and death penalties. This has to do with athletics. I am prolife, anti crime, hardcore right wing, and yet I believe the playing field needs to be level in the area of athletics.
Like it or not, private schools have significant advantages in the area of athletics. It's not just that they have better coaching. They win a statistically significantly higher percentage of state championships and nationwide, activities associations are dealing with it.
You can say public schools are less efficient, but flood the private schools with problem/special needs kids and see what happens to their efficiency.
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