Absolutly you can. According to the rule book and this was a Point Of Emphasis this year. The top wrestler in DOT is allowed to "control wrestle" which basically means he can ride a lundy or put the legs in etc etc. However if he uses a move to "hold on" such as drop down to one leg and just hold on, the first time he does this it is to be called a stalemate, if he does back to using a "hold on" move then stalling will be called an penalized according to where that wrester is in the penalty sequence, eithre a warning or a point and the match is over.

so it's perfectly okay to have a 2 on 1 and just hang on for the fun of it (for deal life :S) or put in the legs and just sit there and power half or hang on?

It wouldn't be a judgement call if it were called the way they do collegiately. Two steps back, ding, stalling. The action should continuously show a effort to improve position, whether takedown, escape, or fall. I'm tired of grabbing the two one one or russian tie-up for 20 seconds. If it isn't used for scoring opportunities, then it's stalling.

Hate to say it, but most DI heavyweights are moving faster than a good percentage of our 103 lbers.

Bronco in double ot it is commonly accepted that most normal riding moves can be applied the entire 30 seconds of the tiebraker without penalty, they are normally considered control wrestling moves. In the course of regulation time you are limited by how long you can actually do this without coming off the hips or attempting a fall. The purpose of the tiebraker however is to control your opponent.

But say for example the bottom wrestler hits a move and turns into his opponent but does not free himself, maybe he grabs a leg, in this situation a stalemate should be called rather quickly, basically as soon as both wrestlers stop making an attempt to move.

If you ever watch a match refereed by Bob Warkentine those guys will be moving the whole time or get dinged for resting. I love it because for the money you pay to get into some events you hate to watch two guys just sit there staring at each other like an awkward middle school Valentine's Dance.

Every ref makes a bad call now and again and every participant and/or fan is able to forgive it based on the fact that most refs know they made a bad call, and while they may not reverse the call, they usually are more aware and do not repeat the mistake OR they make it up to the wronged wrestler in other calls. There are really only 2 times the bad calls are really hard to forgive.
1. When it is the final call that decides the winner.
2. When the ref becomes defensive and repeats the bad call over and over as if to prove his point...

The best ref is the one you can't remember because he did not make himself a participant in the match, just an objective observer.

Aaron do you have a man crush on Bob?

I cannot imagine why anyone would say that the quality of the GWAL finals were down. Some weights maybe were not as good, many were better.
Come on, Patterson/Creekmore, Hurd/Elliott, Adcock/Jonas, Tucker/Arnold, Rodriguez/Jonas, Sponsel/Edison, Jessen,Louis. All of these are top quality competitive kids. Most of the finalist are state ranked. I thought that the finals were very entertaining and that the fans definately got their monies worth.
In the 189lb. match, the referee made the right call. Blood was visible and the whistle was blown prior to the takedown which could be considered a "dead ball" if you will. Sorry, that is just the way that it is.
And your assessment of the thoughts or feelings of the Southeast coaches and wrestlers is not only innappropriate and offensive, it is wrong. Steinacker lost to Brenner 11-7 in the dual. Although he may have been "outclassed", I can assure you that none of us were looking for a "mercy killing" as you so eloquently implied. But thanks for your "opinion" anyway.
Have a nice day.

Here is a question for the officals. If a wrestler was warned and later penalized for stalling (dropping to an ankle) would it then be call it a stalemate if he dropped to an ankle and held on in double overtime?
I just wanted to see what various interpretations would be. In my opinion our current rules on overtime wrestling don't promote wrestling, but rather stalling.

I have no problem stating I was wrong, when I am. First off, the scoring on the clock did not indicate the takedown was waved off. So, from a fan perspective, it appeared they started in the wrong position. So if I was wrong about my interpretation of the score on the clock vs. what actually transpired on the mat, so be it. I was wrong. I thought I was paying attention, I guess I wasn't.

As for the 189 lb match, not knowing the score from the previous matchup, I have to go with what I saw. At no point in time did I imply a "mercy killing" and I'm sure that when the coaching staff met with the wrestler, the first thing they worked on was trying to get the wrestler to stop grabbing over the top as a counter to a takedown. Now knowing the score of the previous meeting, I'm lead to believe this was not the best match the SE wrestler has wrestled. I'm sure he was frustrated after leaving the mat, knowing he can do better.

Lastly, the quality of the tournament as a whole was down, for a variety of reasons. At no point in time did I say they were horrible. I do think the officiating was bad, but not the wrestlers themselves. Perhaps I had a jaded view of the quality of wrestling there, having spent two years at SE and witnessing some of the best wrestling I've seen at the high school level.

I'll just give the names I remember.....

South had Calvin, Fox, and a host of other studs.

Carroll had Maze, Johnston, and many more

Heights had Tapler, a 112 lb state placer and a couple of others

West was stacked.

Kaupun had Hoover and Kline with a few others.

My last year at Southeast, the last state champ didn't even place. In the finals were Cline and Calvin. 3rd and 4th were one of the twins from West and (I can't remember, forgive me) and I think someone from Carroll.

I remember watching the tournament and thinking to myself, this is one wicked league. Knowing a little bit more than the average bear about the caliber of wresters from the city league, I was bummed out based on the matchups this year as compared to the matchups in year's past. Maybe I set the bar too high.

The talent pool as a whole has dropped a ton. I wrestled with Calvin, Bainum and some of the other guys that came out of wichita around 2000 and 01 at labette. As a whole the state of kansas has had a drop in the talent pool. It's so much easier for kids to go play basketball than to wrestle it sux but it's the truth..

"I cannot imagine why anyone would say that the quality of the GWAL finals were down. Some weights maybe were not as good, many were better.
Come on, Patterson/Creekmore, Hurd/Elliott, Adcock/Jonas, Tucker/Arnold, Rodriguez/Jonas, Sponsel/Edison, Jessen,Louis. All of these are top quality competitive kids. Most of the finalist are state ranked. I thought that the finals were very entertaining and that the fans definately got their monies worth.
In the 189lb. match, the referee made the right call. Blood was visible and the whistle was blown prior to the takedown which could be considered a "dead ball" if you will. Sorry, that is just the way that it is.
And your assessment of the thoughts or feelings of the Southeast coaches and wrestlers is not only innappropriate and offensive, it is wrong. Steinacker lost to Brenner 11-7 in the dual. Although he may have been "outclassed", I can assure you that none of us were looking for a "mercy killing" as you so eloquently implied. But thanks for your "opinion" anyway.
Have a nice day."

Get em boy! "GWAL Coach of the Year raises hell on the internet"

I can see the newspaper article now! Lemon for President!

Finally, I get affirmation and a vote (or at least a nomination) and for President no doubt. I thank you and I will work very hard to live up to the expectations that you have for me.

Coach Neil are you talking about the Wiscomb, Malloy double OT match?

What's up with man crush on this site? I think he's a great ref and I admire him for that. He's easily in the top 3 refs in the state in my book.

Toad

Actually, my question is rhetorical, but there was a situation in that match that was similar to my question. My question was merely to point out the inconsistency of the rule on stalling. If hanging on to a leg is stalling during regulation time then why it shouldn’t it be stalling in the overtime period? It isn’t according to the rule. The overtime period(s) are supposedly an extension of the regular match: technical violations, stalling, illegal hold etc. So who was the brain surgeon who thought up the stalemate call for holding on? In my opinion, again my opinion, our current overtime procedure encourages stalling. I would love to see it go back to wrestling three one minute rounds again.
Wrestling sure use to be a lot (notice the seperation a-lot) less complex before the really smart people got involved and wanted to add more rules. Hell, I can’t keep up on all of the changes they make in Freestyle and Greco. For instance, why the heck should a guy lose a match because he broke his grip (Karelin vs. Gardner). What a dumb rule! Sorry, I digress.

Coach L. come on, we all ways knew you were great and brought us a long way. I knew Coach of the year had to be you this year or next year.