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 Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: houndpower]
#214594
02/17/13 06:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,443
RichardDSalyer
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If the arch bishop strongly believes mixed wrestling goes against the teachings of the church, then the schools under him should not participate in sports that are of mixed gender. Rule 23 of KSHAA states that at the beginning of each season, schools have to declare whether their sports team will be a boys, girls,or a mixed team. The bishop can then decide whether to eliminate the sport or ban their teams from competing against schools declaring theirs as a mixed team. I can assure you the Archbishop and the appropriate officials of the Catholic Schools involved are well aware if the Archdiocese did not offer the sport of wrestling, the problem is solved.
Richard D. Salyer
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: KevinP]
#214595
02/17/13 06:32 PM
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Peanut1234
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Kevin, this a site where we talk about everything wrestling. I and everyone would appreciate you not thinking or talking about my manhood.
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: RichardDSalyer]
#214597
02/17/13 06:35 PM
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Beeson
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In closing, priests are men, men are fallible and not perfect, and we all will make mistakes. A boy forfeiting a match to a girl because of his faith is not one of these mistakes. Richard, Did you just nicely tell me I was wrong? Careful, people will think your getting soft. Like I said late last night, all I want is for everyone to play by the same rules. If a school is unable to follow the rules they should not be able participate. I am not saying this because of jealousy, envy, hatred, or anything else.
Unnecessary Roughness is Necessary
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Forum reader]
#214599
02/17/13 06:39 PM
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Beeson
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So the Arch Bishop is the one to blame. He picks and chooses what rules to follow and to what extent that they will be enforced. Sounds like a man with questionable morals. Maybe he should step down. And by the way, I have questionable morals, but Im not a leader of a religious group that effects the lives of thousands of people. Wow, there is just nothing Beeson won't say. I can't imagine actually having a conversation with him. Questioning the Arch Bishop's morals because of this decision. Way out of line. Questioning leadership(not my leader) is wrong? I'm way out of line? I don't think so, leaders being questioned is what built this country. Not questioning them is what lead to the terrible things that Richard spoke of in his post. Questioning keeps people honest. No one should be given free reign, not even me.
Unnecessary Roughness is Necessary
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Beeson]
#214601
02/17/13 06:43 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,465
Chief Renegade
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Like I said late last night, all I want is for everyone to play by the same rules. All schools are subject to this rule... Rule 6 Section 4 Art. 4 Any coach of the contestant or the contestant has the prerogative to default a match at any time prior to the conclusion of wrestling by informing the referee. SJA and STA did just that and so could any other school.
Eric Johnson
Acts 4:12
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Chief Renegade]
#214602
02/17/13 06:48 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
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Beeson
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Like I said late last night, all I want is for everyone to play by the same rules. All schools are subject to this rule... Rule 6 Section 4 Art. 4 Any coach of the contestant or the contestant has the prerogative to default a match at any time prior to the conclusion of wrestling by informing the referee. SJA and STA did just that and so could any other school. I just have a hard time with a wrestler forfeiting just because they don't want to wrestle. If an average wrestler forfeited to a superior wrestler everytime they had to wrestle, people would think poorly of the average wrestler. And those now saying this is no big deal, are the ones that were complaining to begin with.
Unnecessary Roughness is Necessary
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Beeson]
#214603
02/17/13 06:50 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,465
Chief Renegade
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Just as long as you stop bringing up the false claim that they don't wrestle under the same rules.
Eric Johnson
Acts 4:12
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Chief Renegade]
#214605
02/17/13 07:11 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 42
houndpower
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Did they default or forfeit as the rules are different?
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Chief Renegade]
#214606
02/17/13 07:12 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 57
Peanut1234
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Chief, simple question. The rule you quoted seems to imply that a match would have to be started. ( wrestlers appear, shake hands and the whistle blows to start the match) what am I missing?
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Peanut1234]
#214607
02/17/13 07:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,443
RichardDSalyer
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Chief, simple question. The rule you quoted seems to imply that a match would have to be started. ( wrestlers appear, shake hands and the whistle blows to start the match) what am I missing? While I am not Chief I will provide the appropriate rules definition. NFHS Rules: Section 7 Default Default: A default is awarded when one of the competitors is unable to continue wrestling for any reason. Section 13 Forfeit Forfeit: When the opponent, for any reason, fails to appear for a match. In order to receive a forfeit the wrestler shall be dressed in a legal wrestling uniform and appear on the mat.
Richard D. Salyer
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: RichardDSalyer]
#214608
02/17/13 07:37 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 42
houndpower
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"Continue wrestling" would imply that the match had already started
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: RichardDSalyer]
#214609
02/17/13 07:44 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 57
Peanut1234
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Richard...TY.
So yesterday, neither the STA or SJA (as well as the MV wrestler) came to the mat to start the match. By the definition you provided it appears it was a forfeit. but then again the MV wrestler did not appear on the mat to receive it.
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: houndpower]
#214610
02/17/13 07:46 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,443
RichardDSalyer
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Did they default or forfeit as the rules are different?
Both matches were scored as Injury Default.
Richard D. Salyer
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: RichardDSalyer]
#214611
02/17/13 07:51 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 42
houndpower
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So. The matches started as the rules state "a default may only be awarded after the match has begun"
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: RichardDSalyer]
#214613
02/17/13 07:52 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 57
Peanut1234
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Richard.....you are the man.....simply answers to simply questions. Just as some of us have questioned......their was no injury by either wrestler. Not that complicated.
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: houndpower]
#214614
02/17/13 07:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,443
RichardDSalyer
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"Continue wrestling" would imply that the match had already started Section 17 Article 2 Match: A match begins when the proper wrestler reports to the scorer's table in dual matches and tournaments until the conclusion of wrestling. The conclusion of wrestling occurs when the time expires at the end of the third period, when the overtime ends, or when a fall, technical fall, disqualification or a default or forfeit occurs.
Richard D. Salyer
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Peanut1234]
#214615
02/17/13 07:57 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 57
Peanut1234
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Richard....just an FYI.....be ready.....you about to get blasted for disagreeing with the powers at be of this form page. And just for the record.....are you jealous of or do you envy the private schools?
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Peanut1234]
#214617
02/17/13 08:02 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 153
AAA
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Regionals are over time to move on to state!! How bout some predictions??
Kevin Seybold
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Peanut1234]
#214618
02/17/13 08:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,443
RichardDSalyer
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Posts: 8,443 |
Richard...TY.
So yesterday, neither the STA or SJA (as well as the MV wrestler) came to the mat to start the match. By the definition you provided it appears it was a forfeit. but then again the MV wrestler did not appear on the mat to receive it. I was not at Mill Valley. If the events are as you describe and neither wrestler reported to the scorer's table, the match should have been scored as a double forfeit. It is my understanding, and again I was not involved, the KSHSAA provided guidance on the way to handle the matter. If the guidance provided by KSHSAA was followed and neither wrestler reported to the mat, it appear to be an approved NFHS rules violation.
Richard D. Salyer
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Re: Catholic Boy Wrestlers may have to forfeit...
[Re: Peanut1234]
#214619
02/17/13 08:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,443
RichardDSalyer
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Richard....just an FYI.....be ready.....you about to get blasted for disagreeing with the powers at be of this form page. And just for the record.....are you jealous of or do you envy the private schools? This is not Richard's first rodeo and Richard has broad shoulders and thick skin. I have no issue with individuals who disagree with my opinion. I only ask for honesty in discussion. My blunt style of communication has led to disagreements among forum members on this talk forum and I do try to respect all but one individual and that is because I caught him in a mistruth. If an individual tells a mistruth how will you ever know if he is telling the truth?
Richard D. Salyer
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