I believe that it is unfair to to Outstanding Wrestlers that went to Nebraska and then get punished by the Kansas Kids by not allowing them to participate @District. They should be allowed.

I do not know if unfair is the correct word, however I believe it would have been in our States best interest to allow them to compete in both.

In District 2 alone there were some where in the neighborhood of 265 potential spots not filled for the District tournament.

Here is the breakdown by age:
Sub 08 10 12 14 16 Total
North 16 25 24 18 26 109
South 14 19 41 41 41 156
Total 30 44 65 59 67 265

While it is true that we could not have filled all 265 of these positions for our District tournament, we could have filled it with some of the best wrestlers in the country.
As evidenced by the outstanding job Kansas Wrestlers did at the Brute Nationals.

How many of these outstanding wrestlers would have placed at Kansas Kids State?

Would having these wrestlers made the State Tournament more exciting?

There is a walk-on waiver for High School and Middle School Wrestlers and I think for this tournament it would have been in our sports best interest to allow them to walk-on for Districts.

I don't think they are getting punished. They made there choice to go. My question is why have 16 and under if they don't want to wrestle in Kids and what to go other places. I feel like they are bailing out on the Kids program by going to Nebraska.

bonechip- "Bailing out on the kids program by going to Nebraska" WHAT?! How many high school kids get scholarships by being a sub-district youth champion? These young men put it on the line by going toe to toe with some of the nations best in order to attract national attention in hopes of gaining a wrestling scholarship to the best school their skill will allow. I wrestled through the youth program and high school and didn't pursue national tournaments thinking I could still get a look from a college, and I did. But it was a division III school, which at that time would not offer much if any of a scholarship. Had my coach told me that I needed to pursue competition at a national level, I would have in a heartbeat. I am a high school coach now and I encourage any of my wrestlers to seek out the best competition possible. I'm sorry, but I helped work a sub-district and I can tell you that the competition was better at the National tournament in Nebraska. By the way, most of those young men have competed in little league most of their lives. To say they simply "bailed" on our youth program is ignorant. If anything, they were trying to prove the strength of Kansas wrestling (youth programs included) by competing at this elite level. I understand your sentiment, but if these young men aren't in a state bracket we should look at it as an opportunity for another individual to step up and win a state title which should boost his/her confidence for the next year.

How many of the wrestlers who participated in Nebraska would have entered the Kids tournament?

If a list were available with all names immediately, I would be willing to contact the State Tournament directors about a walk on exception for these athletes. I do know the topic was discussed at the Executive Council meeting in February, and there was NO interest in allowing the athletes to participate in both.

If we knew exactly how many of these athletes wished to participate, it MAY not be to late to accomodate these wrestlers.

Most all District Brackets have been prepared, however how difficult is it to add a pigtail match to an eight (8) man bracket, or perhaps add a wrestler to a round robin bracket. The time to act in NOW, with a list of names and weights of wrestlers wishing to participate.

I have to agree with mawcoach these kids should not now be allowed to come back and take a spot at the districts. That's not to punish them in anyway but the walk-on rule was established for kids still participating in junior high now middle school. To my knowledge it hasn't been used in years and probably should be eliminated. Rather than worry about these high school kids who did have an opportunity to participate in either the subs or the national tournament, I would worry about all those openings in the younger age groups. While I don't have any numbers to back this up, in scanning the D2 results it appears to me that we have a far lesser number of wrestlers in the 12U, 10U and 8U ages. Certainly, we have fewer than the late 80's early 90's. This should be a warning sign for our sport. If I'm right, and the numbers are continuing to fall as in years past we have a HUGE problem and we better get to addressing it.

Richard,

I look at our High Schoolers as ambassadors to the kids club in Manhattan. Our guys made a conscious choice even though it was heart wrenching one to wrestle and coach with the little guys that look up to them. It's not about State titles to 16yr olds they have had their season. I think this says a lot about the character of these young men that want to give back to the club that give them so much over the years.

I spoke to the powers to be month ago about an exemption to walk on an there was not much interest in doing this for the guys who had aspirations of doing both. It's a shame that these young men had to make a choice between their clubs and the national spot light.

I do believe that if this would have been an USA Wrestling sanctioned event, they would have been allowed to participate in both "politics".

Maybe next year something could be changed for the better.

Mark Miller
Manhattan Wrestling

If you have wrestlers that want to get scholarships wrestle Cadets and Juniors. You will find more collage coaches at this tournament than you did at Nebraska. Why have 16 and und than if they all want to go to Nebraska and wrestle. I have always been in favor of keeping the 16 and under and not allowing 6 and under in the state tournament. But I am starting to change my tune.

why not allow 6 and under they work just as hard as the older guys and deserve to participate in an event of high calibur such as state

plus they are fun to watch because in 10 years when u see them you could be like wow they're good now

I would love to see the high school age group of kids have an open state tournament at the same time as kids, cut the kids off with the 8th graders and then have the freshman v freshman, soph vs soph and junior vs junior format at the open tourney,,spread the success out a bit, solve some who is the best debates and i think you would increase particpation and interest

Want to know where the young wrestlers are look at the 6 and under numbers. 1600 6 and under the most of all the age groups. According to the number on the home page of USAWKS. To a little more than 500 16 and under. The 16 year olds had there chance to show themselves at the high school level. They knew what they were doing when they chose Nebraska. I believe subs is a quailifing tournament for districts. Quailifing being the important word there.

I believe all three 1st placers at State from Haysville wanted to wrestle at kids.
Josh Baldridge,
Joseph Cornejo,
David Anderson

seriously bcs234 u gotta be kidding me as a high school wrestler that hopes to wrestle in college i have to agree with Mawcoach. There are more opportunitys to succed by wrestling in other state tournaments by being part of the Kansas team and going to nationals and everything like that. many choose to wrestle kids because it keeps us in shape. Yet when we have to choose between possible scholarships and helping out a kids club that has helped the high school out for many years and also has helped me and many of the varsity wrestlers become good. that is not right this should be an USA sanctioned event. Where u get to go to districts the next week. And as for us having a chance to show ourselfs at the high school level pshhh most of the time we are only wrestling kids in our own class like 6a or 5a or 4a whereas in kids its all combined.

I wanted to wrestle kids club. I went to Nebraska because I wanted to try and place in a NATIONAL tournament. Grater went to Nationals and I know that his parents would have loved him to wrestle kids also. I think that some people love to watch the 16 and under, because there are a lot of state champs from high school that get matched up and go at it. I am not sure why we weren't allowed, but hey I will be there to support!

The high school kids are better off not wrestling kids state. The cadets should be focused on USA Nationals and the juniors ought to be getting ready for Southern Plains FS/GR. Noone is going to get a scholarship b/c they won kids state.

This very issue was brought up to the Kids Executive Council because we knew it was a conflict with the Sub-District Qualifiers and the HS National Tournament. To be honest, I don't know that the Exec. Council could have made the decision since it would need to be brought before the State Body.

Since it was not approved for them to do both, the wrestlers had to make a choice and our son was one of them who made the choice to go to the HS Nationals in Nebraska.

Whether you think it was right or wrong, it was their choice. Yes, he would have loved to come back and wrestle his last year in Kansas Kids. However, he is looking ahead, as well as next years HS Senior Nationals, and at this time, his goals are set to wrestle somewhere in college. Yes, the coaches were their and they were watching the wrestlers from across the United States.

Did he bail on Kansas Kids or the wrestlers in our local club? No he did not, because he is coming back in the wrestling room and working with these wrestlers and helping prepare them for our District and State Tournament.

Danny has a little brother who we hope will make it to state this year. Danny had enough heart when he made his decision to go to Nationals to work with his little brother and others in reaching their goals as State Qualifers. Danny's feelings were that is was Gavin's time at Kids State and he would be there supporting him and helping coach him. (Don't worry he's been through the certification classes and has a current coaches card).

As someone said, these kids that went to Nationals bailed out on Kansas Kids. No they did not; they were mature enough and made a choice because they were not allowed to wrestle both. Some of them have their goals and priorties in the right place and it is time for the them to look ahead. I doubt any of them who went would have done anything different, other than wrestled in both tournaments if they had been allowed to.

For a first year tournament, it was ran well. Yes, there is room for improvement, but I can guarantee you this tournament will only grow. The competition was great and it prepares them for other National competitions that many of them will be attending over the summer. I've heard the date may be different next year as they know it conflicted with several other tournaments/qualifiers.

It will be discussed again at the Exec. Council Meeting and at the State Body Meeting and hopefully provisions can be made by the STATE BODY to allow them to compete in both.

Don't blame these kids for "bailing out" on Kansas. They represented our state well in Nebraska at the National HS Tournament and we should be proud of them to have the guts to go and compete whether they placed at the tournament or not!!

Leanna Grater

Mrs. Grater-
I could not have put that in better words. That is also great what Danny is doing with his little brother. I wish Gavin the best of luck with kids! And also good luck to everyone else!

Also I think that the great "Bill Stanhope" would have loved the Nationals. He loved any tournament that had nationaly ranked kids that came together and rep there state. But he would also loved to see them return and wrestle kids here in kansas. He is the one that started me in wrestling with a National tournament(St. Luis AAU).

God Bless Bill Stanhope and Mark Perez (many memories in my wrestling younger days).

bonechip-Are all good folkstyle wrestlers good FS/GR? Not necessarily. You can wrestle cadets/juniors but if you are not seasoned in these styles, you might not be competitive enough to attract attention. Whereas, in Nebraska it was folkstyle and their where many college coaches in attendance who could watch exactly how you would perform in college style events, not FS/GR.